Power – It Ghost against all logic (with Kolby Told Me)

Full transcript of Power – It Ghost against all logic (with Kolby Told Me).

0:00KT: Good day. Welcome back to For Your Reference. We're starting off with Quid Pro Mo. And if you can see the duration of this episode, you're going to need a snack. And if you're a Power fan, you are definitely in for a treat. We had to bring in our pal Kolby to really round off the ending almost ending of the Starz juggernaut series take the promo away

0:32Clip: Yo. Yo. Yo. What up? It's your boy, Kolby Mac, host of the Kolby Told Me podcast. It's my whenever I want to deep dive with the movie Mac himself, where I get to amplify my movie reviews for your listening pleasure.

0:48Clip: In a landscape of so many movie pods to enjoy, plug me in for a sweet solo spin on all the newest release, box office, news, previews in around thirty minutes or less. I'm the best subjectively objective movie critic in the game. So when they ask you where you heard it from, you tell them Kolby Told Me. Peace.

1:37KT: Hey, friends and lovers. Welcome back to For Your Reference. You've got your host, KT.

1:37Oti: And Oti.

1:37KT: And we have an iconic guest, the best guest to round out the rest of this year. Stay tuned. We will have more episodes, but this is going to be a great one. Would you like to introduce yourself?

1:57Kolby: Yo. Yo. Yo. What up? It's your boy, Kolby Mac, and I'm on the For Your Reference podcast.

2:04KT: Oti is actually cheering right now. He was really hoping for a full on Kolby experience.

2:12Oti: I've listened to your intro for your podcast, I think, number to us.

2:17KT: Yes.

2:20Oti: And, yeah, the fact that it's on our podcast now, it's just, me. Thank you.

2:27KT: Merry Christmas. So, Kolby, you are most welcome in the For Your Reference household. You don't even have to leave after this. You can stay. We might ask for rent after a while, but you are most welcome to stay. Also, late birthday.

2:40Kolby: Hey. Thank you very much. I really do appreciate it. Chapter 33 has begun. It was a great birthday. I got a chance I love as I get older, like, I just make excuses on my birthday to eat whatever I want without judgment from my wife. So I like that a lot.

2:58KT: I I genuinely believe in the science of calories not counting on your birthday, when the sun's not out, and when you're having a sad time.

3:11Kolby: Oh, I like that. I like that a lot. But it was it it was it was a lot of fun. And I took a nap too on my birthday. It was great. Like, I love that I could take a nap so, like, not like, just unshamelessly. Like, I'll just take a nap whenever I want because I need it now because I'm older. Naps are the most pleasurable

3:29KT: of experiences. And you know what else is? This fucking episode, guys. So you better you better strap in. It is the moment of truth. If you're nasty, grab your stick up crew, grab your Mustang, because we are covering Power this week. They say this is a big rich pod.

3:50Oti: Oh, I see you went with the Trey Songz version.

3:53KT: Wow. Rude. Rude. And if you're listening to this, I challenge you to find a non thirsty Trey Songz GIF. It's impossible. He is a thirsty man treasure. And all of the ladies are thirsty for him. What can we say? And speaking of thirsty, you are in the right place, guys. If this is the first time you've listened to For Your Reference, you were in for a great treat. And if this is your second, third, three times a podcast listening to For Your Reference, you know there's gonna be some continual

4:26KT: pleasurable moments, and Kolby will be a part of that experience now. If you have moseyed on over from Kolby's podcast, thank you. You're most welcome. But we are going to have a delight of a time today. Sure are. So get ready. Satiate your senses because this is a great show. So let's get started the way we always get started into stats. Power is a show that came out in 2014, and most likely,

4:58KT: this iteration of Power is going to be ending next year. The mid season finale just came out, so we're right hot off the press. But this particular instance of Power is going to be ending next year. They mentioned that they're going to be expanding. But this iteration, 2014 to 2020, it's on the Starz network. Starz is a cute little unassuming person, like, you know, the one in the movie that has glasses and they take it off and put their hair down, and you realize that they were the hottest girl around. Mhmm.

5:29Kolby: You know, you Rachael Leigh Cook and She's All That. Yeah.

5:32KT: Exactly. Your crush. So we've got Spartacus, Outlander, obviously, Power as well. So, you know, Starz is definitely one to watch. And I'm not sure if you guys knew, but Power is the most successful show of Starz as of now.

5:32Kolby: Yep. I could see that.

5:32KT: It even beat Outlander. The season three premiere of Power got the most viewers.

5:58Oti: Don't get me wrong. Like, I know there's a lot

5:58KT: Woah.

5:58Oti: Of

5:58KT: Woah. Hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. Are we gonna start fighting already?

5:58Oti: No. I'm just saying, like, Outlander gets a lot of love out there, but I've tried watching the thing several times. I've just never couldn't get it.

6:12KT: And if you do love Outlander, please stay with us. KT will love you forever. But yeah. So we have the creator, Courtney A. Kemp, who I'm slowly becoming obsessed with, and you will hear why as we continue with this episode. And then we also have 50 Cent because I always thought it was a 50 Cent show until I kept digging. But, you know, like, you know, Get Rich or Die Tryin', but also this narrative is too cohesive for 50 Cent to manage by yourself.

6:40KT: Like, you you can put glasses on the man, but it's still 50 Cent. You know what I'm saying, kids? You know what I'm saying? So let's let's get all delightful because we are amicable, learned people. Let's dive into our first impressions. So, you know, this is the section where we talk about, you know, how do we come across Power? Was it big in our circles? Are there any sort of resonating factors?

7:08KT: Are there any actors, you know, that made you watch this because you love them so much, like Naturi, for example, and that's how you came across Power? Kolby, would you like to start us off?

7:08Kolby: Yeah. Absolutely.

7:20Kolby: I came to Power late. I missed the initial wave because, one, I'm primarily a movie guy. I watch so much movies. It's hard to try to devote, like, a special segment amount of time for a TV series because it's a lot it's a lot of investment. And, usually, when it comes to series, like, I have specific ones based on the season that we're in. But when I moved to Atlanta back in 2015, I've heard of Power and stuff like that. I was an Empire guy. I think there was, like, this cultural conversation.

7:52Kolby: Are you a Power guy? You're an Empire guy? Which show you watch? Which is better? And they're beefing and stuff like that. One, I wasn't on Twitter back then. Like, I had a Twitter, just never used it. Mhmm. And then when I moved to Atlanta in 2015 and I became a supervisor

8:10Kolby: at my day job, I worked in sales for Comcast. And we had an a Starz rep come to my building Oh. And, you know, just help us push the Starz app. So, yeah, so I was on that side of it selling Starz, a part of cable subscription. So I'm like, alright. Well, obviously, I gotta understand these shows to really try to tap in to our client base to appeal to them. And I said, you know what? Everybody keeps talking about this show. Let me give it a watch. Right? Mhmm. And

8:38Kolby: at the time, I was watching Game of Thrones, and somebody said, yo. This is like Game of Thrones, but for the hood. I'm like, shut the shut up. Like, what happened to the studio? I watched the first episode, and I'm just floored. Now as a critic, I know when to turn the critic lens down and up. Mhmm. I took the glasses off completely with this series because one,

9:04Kolby: if you can't tell, it comes out a little bit. When I when I when I talk about my love for New York, I was born in Florida, but I was raised in New York from the time that I was 10 years old, so I became a man, right? And there's so much of this story that impresses upon me because I lived this life. I wasn't a corner boy, not like that, but a lot I I I ran with a lot of these, peak people from this Right? And

9:31Kolby: I finally came to the show not knowing real I knew there was a 50 Cent produced show, but I didn't know Omari Hardwick. I think the only recognizable name honestly at that time was Naturi Naughton that you know from 3LW. Like, I was big in the Cheetah Girls, and I knew that she was she was originally supposed to be in the Cheetah Girls, but then 3LW split up. Like, I was a Disney kid. And, yeah, obviously,

9:53Kolby: she has she's changed up quite a bit. She did a movie Lil Kim. Where she played, Lil Kim. And I remember that's the first time she did a topless scene. She was, you know, I was wow. And I was I was managing a movie theater at that time. I'm like, woah. Okay. Just keep rewinding it. I'm like I'm like, what Charlamagne tha God said on The Breakfast Club? She had Hershey kisses nipples. Yeah. Hershey kisses. Shout out. But I was yeah. But, yeah, that that first episode completely

10:21Kolby: floored me. It it it brought me back to this world that I left, and I didn't know that really strong stories could be told from it. And it's regardless of any type of, like, objective, you know, you know, cinema practices. It's just it's really strong storytelling that connects to a lot of people. And and I just rode the wave ever since. So when I actually got into it, think it was the start of like, season three was about to start up. And then I just binged seasons one and two, like, super fast.

10:53KT: Nice. Oti?

10:55Oti: Well,

10:56Oti: I guess I heard Naturi's gonna be in this. I was like, yep. I'm in.

11:01KT: Add it add it to your folder that's called finance.

11:06Oti: For sure. Because we'd watched her in Notorious just a few years back, and I was like, I'm definitely in for this. But I didn't realize it was her. Like, I didn't realize it was Naturi from 3LW. I was just like, she's a sexy lady. Mhmm. For sure. And I did not get disappointed. I watched this on a weekly, like, sort of basis because I started watching it when it came out and

11:28Oti: it just stuck with me. Like it was really impressive and the fact that people compared it to Empire, I really didn't see that sort of comparison at all. Empire was its own thing which we actually kind of just stopped watching after

11:28KT: Were you starting see which

11:44KT: show stood the test of time?

11:45Oti: For sure. For sure. Agreed. Yeah. And and that's like all I have for this show in terms of first impressions because I was just sold into it for the fact that it's storytelling. It was really interesting. Omari just playing Ghost captures the hell out of me. I'm a fan of Ghost up until now and I know you'll disagree with me in that. But, yeah, I really love this.

12:10KT: Is this is it my time for my first impressions?

12:10Oti: Yeah. Go for it.

12:10KT: First off, Oti, fuck your Ghost and the clique you claim. Who shot you? Okay? Right? Yep. I'm done. We can finish this podcast because Ghost is fucking shit. And I don't know how you feel, Kolby, but let me go through our first impressions, and we can get into the show. And I actually don't think I ever heard about Power because Oti and I, for a long time,

12:41KT: there was, like we had a lot of long distance years. And if you've listened to our podcast before, Oti is very generous in his time and his patience. So he will watch a lot of shows even if he doesn't like it. Like, he will watch a full season of something he doesn't like. Whether it's t yeah. Whether it's TV shows, whether it's movies,

13:03KT: like, he will watch a lot of shit. Like and I will watch the same thing over and over. Someone put some effort in producing it. You might as well watch it. But I feel like Empire got I feel like Empire got a lot more advertising because I had never heard of Power. Right? And that's your fault. The fact that you knew that Power and Empire existed and we watched Empire first together, that's on you, dude. Like, have no one to blame for yourself.

13:27Oti: I've tried to get you to watch a lot of things and you don't go for it. Try to get Power into the mix while I'm still trying to get you to watch Game of Thrones or something else. I was like, yeah. You probably wouldn't like it.

13:38KT: Listen to our Game of Thrones episode because I I give a very poignant, learned analysis of why I'm not a fan of Game of Thrones. But, you know, just going back to just Empire quickly because there was such a comparison between the two shows. And, really, the only thing that was linking it was it was a majority black cast. And there was you know, even behind the scenes,

14:02KT: there were, you know, people that knew what they were talking about in charge as well. And I think that was really the only comparisons because, you know, they're not even of the same sort of world, and they are definitely not cut from the same cloth, I will say. But I also wanna say that Empire did have its time in the sun. Drip drip or whatever is

14:22Kolby: whatever that song Stop pretend, babe. I'll tell you that the first two seasons was some of the best marrying of two different mediums with the way that they were packaging the show and the infusion of the music that you could actually listen to afterwards. Like the one song that this dude did, Jussie did.

14:42KT: Oh, Jussie. Ready to go. Jussie.

14:46Kolby: He was ready to go? I I I lost my shit when that song came out. Like, I was playing that everywhere. And people were like, you know, especially, like, here in Atlanta, they were clowning me because I was a I was an Empire guy, not a Power guy. Yo, why you watch the show for? It's so wet. They don't even show any nudity. Well, yeah, it's network television, my guy. They so that's the gonna do that. Fuck. Right? But Yeah. Yeah. But, like, the show distinctly was about the music and then the family. It was essentially, like, secondary, where in this show,

15:14Kolby: the family is very much primary in Power and all the other elements around it are secondary. And I think that was pretty unique because you wouldn't think that going in. You would think that Power is just about like, you know you know, nudity and, you know, you know, vulgar language and guns and drugs. And that's there, but that's not what the show's about.

15:31KT: Well, it just adds to the context of the show because, yes, it's easier to say, you know, you see titties, and you also see Omari's ass who you know, he is out there. Probably not to the level of being able to kiss Beyonce, but his ass is definitely worth mentioning.

15:50KT: Mhmm. But, you know, it's so easy for people to reduce a show to that. And, you know you know, there are probably some camps that are saying, why do you need to have nudity? Dude, do you get naked in your life? Yes. You do. Like, just real life. Like, it's just a peppering, and it adds to, you know, the context of the show as well. But let's let's dive into Power. I just wanna just lay my accolades to Courtney A. Kemp because I didn't

16:20KT: really I weren't I wasn't really familiar with her work. She was on the Bernie Mac Show, and then she left there. She's written a few episodes for The Good Wife and also Beauty and the Beast. So she's, you know, she's been around, and she's, as far as we can see, has had substantial commercial sort of experience in that Hollywood

16:40KT: sort of world, but I didn't even know that. I just watched Power just to watch it. I heard it was a 50 Cent show. And, usually, when it comes to, you know, these sorts of shows where it's, you know, a personal story with context, with genuine context as well, you're not really well, at least me, I'm not really expecting good writing. I I'm just expecting a good time. You know, like with Empire as well, I'm just expecting a good time having some, you know, meaningful relationship between the characters, but I wasn't really expecting

17:11KT: the depth and cohesion in regards to the narrative. And like I said, I'm slowly becoming obsessed with Courtney A. Kemp because, you know, just even listening to interviews, she knows this show, and she wrote it for a reason. And that those are the shows that I love. Like, shows that mind their own business and know why they're creating the show, and it's not to compete with the inundated, oversaturated market of TV shows. Right? And a lot of the time, she talks about, oh, by the way, spoiler, spoiler, spoiler, but also

17:42KT: fuck your spoiler and the clique you claim. Okay? I'm just gonna keep saying that throughout this episode.

17:49KT: But in regards to this, like, Courtney A. Kemp, especially in season six of Power, she was talking about how there are lots of parallels between Ghost's character and Richard the third. To keep everyone learned, essentially, Richard the third was a shit person. He killed all these people. And then out of nowhere, all these people came to kill him. Like, you know, it's it's that it's that tragedy. It's that comeuppance. It's that sort of nuance that you have throughout a story. And she also talks about she kind of likens Ghost to, like, a reverse Midas. Like, everything he touches turns to ash.

18:22KT: Are you kidding me? We're getting this much depth in a show, and that's why I just wanna lay some accolades for Courtney. And I'm sure 50 Cent with his glasses was helping as well. But I definitely wanna give accolades where accolades are due. Just in regards to what you're saying, Kolby, in regards to the nudity, apparently, all of the main cast had to sign nudity clauses. So if they wanted them to get naked, they they couldn't say anything because they signed it. Mhmm. So that was an interesting thing I just wanted to mention

18:56KT: as well. But let's let's dive into everything that is this show and for five more episodes will be this show because it is it really is. And you know what? You can enjoy this show on surface level, and that's absolutely fine. But for people that want to draw more depth and really dive beneath the surface, there are layers to unpack here. Yeah. And that's what I love about this show. So let's start off with Ghost. So this series is Ghost is essentially at the epicenter of this series, and all of every sort of interconnectedness

19:35KT: comes out of his character. I think he's also from Jamaica Queens, which is where 50 Cent was brought up as well. 50 Cent is the inspiration for this show, so a lot of his personal experiences not all of them, but a lot of his personal experience are interweaved into that. And when Courtney met 50 Cent, that was kind of the spark to create the show Mhmm. As well. But the center's around him. He has a wife, Tasha. He has

20:00KT: I think at the time I'm not sure if the younger kid was born, but they had Raina and they also had Tariq. Oh, we need to talk about Tariq. Really Tariq. Damn you. And, you know, he he owns a nightclub called Truth. Very on the nose, but, you know, you get it where you can. We also have his ride or die best friend, Tommy, who I fucking love. I wouldn't really call him ride or die, but there you Well well, we can we can discuss. Cool. Because that's what we do here very amicably,

20:37KT: might I add. And then you've you've got a whole world surrounding him. But let's let's take our hot takes and our hot shots in regards to Ghost.

20:47Oti: I I love him. Like, what's not to like about him? He's been there. He's done the shitty bit of it. He's he's been a drug dealer. He's done that. He's trying to make his life right. Regardless of whether you agree or not, at least he has a goal. He has well, he has a goal to to be better.

21:07KT: Let's take a quick break, friends and lovers. As we said, there are different sorts of people that enjoy the show. If you just wanna take it on surface level and you wanna stay with Oti. If you if you wanna get nasty and if you wanna dive deep with KT, then you're most welcome to join me. But if you wanna stay in the world of Oti, then you can do that. Everyone in this show is tainted, including Ghost.

21:29Oti: He's not saying he's perfect.

21:29KT: Yes. He is. He he genuinely believes that he does nothing wrong, and that's the problem with him.

21:29Oti: No. He's done some shit. He's trying to rectify that. But people like Tasha are trying to keep him in the game for what? For personal satisfaction and gratification of, oh, where will I get my money from now? Ridiculous.

21:49KT: Come on. In the words of Will Smith in the film, everyone tries to forget, After Earth. Take a knee, Oti. Take a knee, Kolby. Kolby, please help him. Ghost. Yes.

22:02Kolby: Ghost has a lot of layers to him. It's it's a lot of what he projects on the outside as James Saint Patrick. Ghost is very much still on the inside. It's like this this caged animal that he can never kill, but he wants to really lock away. But there's so many elements that surround his daily life that keep rattling the cage for Ghost to come out. And I I think seeing his journey, he is really try this is critic of you talking. He is really trying hard

22:31Kolby: to quell those those those desires, the the the the carnal, you know, wishes that Ghost has, you know, with the the dreamlike aspiration that James Saint Patrick has. I mean, if you look on him, we first get introduced to him, we see him in a suit and tie. Let me tell you something. Yo. Omari Hardwick wears that shit out of a suit. Like, I wish, oh, yeah. I could spill out a suit like that. Like, his suits are expertly tailored. I love it. I I wish I had his hair.

23:00Kolby: I got the beard with nothing on top of that. Let me tell you something. But that's I think that's what I love about Omari Hardwick and his performance as Ghost is that he's balancing a lot of, like, what I had to go through. Like, I had to realize the circles that I was in, and I had to switch up a lot. Right? And it's funny that the film that he did just, you know, last year in Sorry to Bother You was about kinda like code switching and stuff like that. Right? Mhmm.

23:25Kolby: But that's what Ghost is. He's understanding that in order to navigate this world the best that he can, while he has one foot in the game, you know, he's trying to have another foot outside of it, and he has to be different. But it's turning off all the people that are around him from his past. Mhmm. But it's still like so much of his past is catching up to who he wants to be in his future and seeing that duality, seeing that battle every season is so interesting.

23:49Kolby: And you really do have an empathy for him. Like, you want to see this man get what he wants. I'll say that events that happened towards the later part of the seasons show a slightly skewed side, and that last episode, in particular, seems to really kind of undo a lot of, like, the, you know, the the agency that I was giving him.

24:12Kolby: But he is an amazing iconic character. I'll say that. I will say, like, in the pop culture when someone says Ghost, I think that, you know, six out of 10 people point to James St. Patrick, aka Omari Hardwick. Well,

24:25KT: many times throughout watching the series, my friends, I really wished he was a ghost and he would just go away because the okay. So I am actually fine with the protagonist not being perfect. I would prefer that they are damaged in some sort of way because then you get an interesting, hello. Why are you you're here. You're here. That's why. No. But it it it creates an interesting sort of journey for the full character development. What really, you know, foundations my qualms is when you have characters that are shit people,

25:02KT: but they don't like, they they're not self aware enough or they just like to pretend. It's like, oh, I didn't cheat on you, Tasha. That was Ghost. Like, you know what I mean? Can't it just like, I would like to pretend that fake Oti ate the cake, but really KT ate the cake, and the calories are sitting with me. Like, you can't you okay. So cool. You want to you want to be in a new chapter of your life, but you don't realize the path of destruction that you've left behind you.

25:34KT: That's fair. Let that marinate, my friends. I just didn't appreciate it. I didn't care for it. And his philandering ass really just because, you know, we were trying to again, we've tried to you know, we try to talk about TV shows with, like, you know, our our real life people. And, you know, another couple that we were talking about in regards to Power, they were like, oh, you know, it was it started off with something cheating in regards to Jamie and Angela, but then it turned into something real. Nah, man.

26:06Oti: Nah. That's no. But there's years of context with her. Like, it's not just some random girl off the street, though. These are high school sweethearts. High school sweethearts. Like They have known each other for such a long time. And the fact that they separated not because of their own volition,

26:21Oti: it's just circumstances and all. Like, it makes perfect sense that you'll still have lingering feelings after all those years.

26:21KT: The unsung hero is Tasha, and we'll come to Tasha in a second.

26:21Oti: Woah. Fuck Tasha, mate. I don't know.

26:21KT: Woah. Make it clear make it clear that the men of this podcast episode are not standing for Tasha. Do you ever guess Sean?

26:21Oti: Very clear. Wasn't Tasha all over Sean? Hey. Early. Episode two.

26:47KT: Ladies,

26:50KT: back me up. You've never felt frisky and taken off your panties in the car? Whatever. Come and fight me. Come and fight me.

26:50Kolby: I think the dynamic of their relationship is a lot of unspoken

27:02Kolby: kind of, like, rules and moves in a way to operate around each other. But the I think that they were loyal to the idea of a family, not to the practice of of, like like, legit loyalty to the family.

27:13KT: But oh, okay. Let's let's just talk broad sorta optics. Right? Mhmm. It is not easy to be the ride or die. Right? And Naturi well, Tasha's character was down for that life.

27:13Oti: No. She wasn't.

27:13KT: Oh, come on. She was down she was down for the life.

27:13Kolby: She wasn't down for Jamie.

27:13Oti: Yeah. I agree with that.

27:13KT: Well, that's nice. Are you done are you done wanking are you done wanking over each other? Can I finish? Because you guys are finishing each other, obviously. Tasha was down for that life,

27:48KT: and so was Ghost until he decided that he wanted to become legit. I kind of have, like, thoughts about this. And I know, Kolby, you haven't watched The Wire. But for other people that haven't watched The Wire, it's very similar to Avon and Stringer because Idris Elba,

28:04KT: Stringer, he wanted to become legit. Right? And you just realize that whether it's legit or not, you can get played. And that's what happened to Ghost. Right? So what I'm saying is Ghost was one way, and he just turned a different way. And he didn't take Tasha along in that journey. He didn't even give her an opportunity to say, hey. I kind of wanna become legit. Now he just changed. He's like, I'm gonna be with a new woman. I'm gonna go and stay and live with her, and I'm just going to live a legit life. Nah, man. You have a whole family. You have a whole responsibility,

28:37KT: and you're just going to quench that to the side. Whether he wanted to be with Tasha or not is its own thing. But the way that he handled it was a punk ass bitch, and I will fight anyone that says I'm wrong.

28:37Oti: Tasha is a punk ass bitch. She's been with for how long?

28:52Oti: She's been with Ghost for how long. And the fact that she stayed in the game for that long and didn't make didn't save any of her money, she's fucking dumb.

28:52KT: You're a punk ass bitch because you're still with me.

29:04KT: You took this big male vibrato, but you're still with me, motherfucker.

29:09Oti: All I'm saying is Tasha needed to be smart. You cannot have you cannot be in this game and not still rely solely on Ghost or James Why? To be the sole provider. Because The stacks the stacks are coming in. If James if James goes down, then what? What happens to them? What happens to the kids? Happy days. No. Really. Seriously. She had no she didn't even think things through. And the fact that Ghost wanted to go legit and she was so against it because of what it meant for her lifestyle, it's bloody ridiculous.

29:36KT: But I think but she was used to living a certain way. Whether you want to just, you know, dismiss that as frivolous sort of spending, it doesn't matter. She had a lifestyle. She signed up to a life. She did the hard graft. Right? Ghost taught her how to be out in those streets. Right?

29:36Oti: But she didn't learn anything, did she?

29:36KT: You okay.

29:36Oti: Because clearly, she could have saved some money on the side.

29:36KT: If you're not a fan of her, that's fine. But we are a poignant podcast where we can unpack layers.

30:03KT: Okay? Go and watch go and watch Empire then because this this is obviously too much to tackle for you, sir.

30:06Kolby: Well, I think that's that's an interesting comparison. When you take a look at Tasha and then Cookie from Empire, right, you know, two women who were linked to very strong men who took very selfish paths. I will say that a lot of Jamie's actions are very selfish, but it's not to say that like, I don't see Tasha as a victim at all. And I think where, like, the appeal to Cookie

30:34Kolby: from Empire is that when her husband turned her back on you know, turned his back on her, she had her own agency and wills and resources to try to do something about it. She didn't let everything get done to her. I feel like so much of Tasha and her her her life cycle on the show are things being done to her and never doing for herself. She's very dependent on a lot of other things that are falling in place. You know why?

31:01KT: Because when a woman gets courted, the man who he realizes a punk ass bitch says, don't worry, baby. I'll take care of you. I'll buy you everything. And then what? You go and find your high school sweetheart and you just dump it? Nah. Fuck off. Nah. Sorry, mate. I think what Tasha what Tasha really was hoping that Ghost was was Tommy.

31:22Kolby: Tasha would have been ex like, Tommy is loyal to a fault to the woman that he that he loves. Tasha needed a Tommy by her side, not a Ghost.

31:22KT: And this is an interesting thing because Courtney A. Kemp also mentions that Ghost was bred out of logic. So, you know, male logic, which is arguable.

31:42KT: And Tommy Tommy was grown out of love. If you see the driving forces of Ghost and Tommy, they are completely different. Their ambitions and their successes are completely different. And exactly what you're saying about Tommy, he was seeking love in every sense that he could get. And Holly was that once in a lifetime sort of love. You know, you do stupid things. You do dumb things when you're in love, but it was that fully intense,

32:10KT: you'll only experience once in your life sort of love. The only demise that he had in his relationship with Holly is he actually prioritized Ghost over Holly in that instance, and that's why it's soured. Yeah. Oh, so when we're not when we're not besmirching Tasha, you've got nothing to say? Let us let us take a moment. Let's let's let's finish off Ghost once and for all. Spoiler alert. Well, hopefully hopefully for all. Right? I really hope he's that's dead or something. Like, I really hope it's Ghost. But let's let's let's

32:50KT: you know, we can continue talking about Ghost, there's something I wanna mention about him. He is petty as fuck. He is petty as fuck, and he doesn't respect the people that ride for him because Tommy definitely, you know, was by his side and was a great lieutenant by his side, and then he became his own sort of, you know, distro as well. But so many there's so much shade that Ghost throws at Tommy specifically. The problem was that the ambitions that Tommy and Ghost had changed because Ghost wanted to go beyond where they were.

33:26KT: Right? But Ghost is so fucking petty. I don't know a character that is more petty than Ghost because he would always throw shade at Tommy. Right? Saying, I'm better than you. You can't do this without me and all of this motherfucking shit. Right? And he would even do that to Tasha as well. Like, he just had this superiority complex that wasn't proportionate to his genuine nature because he didn't have genuine nature. He was just fucking shit, man.

33:53Kolby: I see that. I I see that. But I I think Tommy I think Tommy was cool in the role that he knew that he could play. That regardless because, I mean, he even had a lot of, you know, the people that he would work for. You know? Like, his Tommy was very resonant in just being, like, the the number two,

34:14Kolby: but he had to propel himself to be the number one because of Ghost's one foot in, one foot out. I mean, I think it had changed. So, like, we look at Tommy, and Tommy is a as he's a menacing character. Like, I didn't know what I was getting with with Joseph Sikora. Like, I honestly I don't I don't know him from nothing. You know? Yeah. And,

34:32Kolby: you know, somebody who's never seen the show when they first like like, my wife, she she caught, like, a couple of she's like, what the hell is going on? I said, listen. I understand. Think of think of this like a soap opera, but, like, just very mature and a lot grittier. That's exactly what this is, but, like, it's a lot of those same, you know, characters and stuff like that. And what Joseph Sikora does with Tommy, like, there's not a moment where it feels dishonest.

34:56Kolby: And when you cast like this, you know, tall white guy to play like this, you know, you know, stereotypically black character, that could be a problem from the jump. Yeah. And it takes a very strong performance to be able to pull that off. So sometimes it's hard for us because he's doing such a good job at being what we know is Tommy. Like, how could you just be so

35:15Kolby: subordinate to to Ghost? Like, you can you can edge Ghost out whenever you want to. Why not? And I think that's what his character flaw was because he he has no desire, like what you said, to ever be more than Ghost. He just wants to be a partner with Ghost. Like, they had a good thing, and that's all he knows. He has no aspirations to know anything else. And Ghost, I think, was frustrated by that because Ghost saw himself in the future, and he recognized that Tommy never did. So I think that's why he

35:42Kolby: with a lot of pity and, like, would throw shade and, like, say little jabs like that, maybe to try to spark something out of him. Like, yo. You know, you could do so much more, but just Tommy has no desire.

35:52KT: Nah, man. I think, like, I really believe, like, Ghost is this he Ghost is that person in your life that is your friend but kind of feels better when they put you down sort of thing. You know what I mean? Like, if you tell them, oh my god. I got a new job. They'll be like, oh, that's great, but then, like, give you some shade. Like, that's great, but, like, you've got a broken family. Eight hours. Yeah. It's

36:16KT: like, that's great, but your wife's cheating on you. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you've got friends that are just like they are your friend, but they also don't want you to be more successful than you are.

36:26Kolby: Yeah. I could I could definitely I could see that competitive nature. And and I think that what Omari Hardwick does a lot to transform this character is that he used a lot of his sports background. He was a semi and even professional athlete for a little bit. So Mhmm. I think that the creators were really writing around their performance, which I love, like, as a as a work still a working actor.

36:48Kolby: I love to be able to have that type of partnership and collaboration with the creative team to say, allow me to try to find ways to transform this character through my performance and let that inform the script down the road. So I can definitely see where Omari was impressing a lot on Ghost. So that makes some that may say something something about, like, his nature because I can see that. I've seen it in interviews and and other things that he's done outside of this role. But Mhmm. And Ghost is

37:14Kolby: he's a really he's a really phenomenal, you know, character. And I think the phenomenal characters that we fall in love with are ones that have a lot of cracks that aren't far from perfect. And I think it's emblematic of this last season to show all of the weaknesses in Ghost's character, that you still can appreciate. But, ultimately, the one thing that I'll always connect to is his love, his selfish love for Angela because I had that. And I just

37:43Kolby: yeah. Once I had that, I said, this this this dude could do whatever he wants. I've I've been in that situation and trying to maneuver it is not easy. And, you know, without it, he probably would have been a lot more successful and not end up in where he possibly is going to end up, but Angela just kinda ruined that all. And sometimes we all just get hit in the face with love, and there's nothing you can do about it.

38:04KT: Yeah. Sometimes with the body parts of love, but that's another podcast that we're not getting into today. So let's talk let's we've already talked a bit about Ghost and also Tommy. Some of the best moments is their sort of brotherhood that you had. Like, even when they killed the first distro, that whole sort of circumstance and when they were coming together.

38:29KT: And even at that point, I don't think there was any sort of animosity between the two, but it was so nice to have Tommy and Ghost moments. Even though later on in the series where, like, Ghost was really grating on me, it was really nice to see the Tommy Ghost sort of dynamic.

38:44Oti: Yeah. Because we've not seen it in such a long time, I think the sort of relationship that they had and the close bond that they developed in the first season, we don't really see that transpiring past the third, I think. And it's something that we've missed and we long for. And in the last season, well, this current season,

39:02Oti: seeing it play out and us rooting for them to just team up for a bit and then us getting, like, really excited seeing them

39:02KT: Speak for yourself.

39:02Oti: Being shot at. And it was like, oh, they're gonna team up finally. Mhmm. And then Tommy disappears and they're like, oh, bloody hell. So it's like their dynamism is something that I don't think I've seen in any show recently.

39:22KT: And the relationship hard to do. The relationship transcends friends because they are actually family. The way that they operate, like, you know, even even with your own family, you can fight like cats and dogs. But at the end of the day, you still have love for each other, and you're still family.

39:22Kolby: Agreed. But they're at the brink of death with one another. They still love each other. It's hilarious. Like, how often that they they

39:45Kolby: genuinely want to kill each other and will never come to grips with, oh, man, I love this guy. Kill, like, they're dead in my hands, which I find, like, very interesting. Like, they Yeah. You could tell they really do love each other because they are forced to work with each other when they clearly don't want to, for a lot of reasons. And, I mean, a lot of this last season is them trying to kill each other. Like, really, like, not hold back. They're trying to kill each other. Yeah. And it's it's it's it's

40:14Kolby: it's really crazy to think I if I ever wanted to kill somebody, I couldn't have that type of love for you. Like Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Be it is crazy.

40:22KT: And, like, their their relationship, they were either were all in with love or they were all in with hate. There was no in between with them. Hate. Yeah. That's very true. And there was there was a lot of, like, you know, like a Shakespearean tragedy. There was there was a lot of parts that were being moved, and there was a lot of players that were being played essentially. Something that Courtney also mentioned is if you're a good person, most likely, you're going to die. Like,

40:49KT: all of the good people die on this show, and it's the terrible trash people that end up continuing in this show. So it's quite realistic.

40:58Oti: Right? And,

41:02KT: really, that is a truth nugget that we all need for today Because, you know, there are some people you wonder how they keep surviving and they're just still there. And I might be looking at him right now. Who knows?

41:16Oti: Don't talk about a boy like that, mate.

41:21KT: I'm not. But let's let's let's focus a bit more on Tasha, and let's be objective if Oti knows what that means.

41:30Oti: OBG, executive? What is this word?

41:33KT: You're setting your people back many years right now. You know that. Say something say something positive about Tasha. Try.

41:33Oti: I like Naturi.

41:33KT: Come on. Who doesn't like Naturi? I'm talking about Tasha, the character. She's street smart. You know? She she Oh, she's actually loves her kids. She loves her kids to her dying day.

41:33Oti: And she can launder money.

41:33KT: No. She has a degree in accounting. Like, she actually knows what she's doing. And speaking of,

42:03KT: I actually wanna hear your guys' thoughts on this. Since you guys love Ghost so much, all throughout the series, he was willing to bear the burden of Tariq killing Ray Ray. Right? And then up until he decided he wanted a new life with Ramona, he's like, nah, man. This is your shit. I'm not gonna carry it for you. He said Tariq Tariq is a punk now. Tariq is not Tariq is a you're a father if you're a father and your son is about to go into jail, would you let him?

42:33Oti: It's one thing being a father, then it's another thing being a father to Tariq. That's some special circumstances you wouldn't put on anyone.

42:44Oti: Man, Tariq is so far gone. That's the one thing that I think also drove a wedge between Tasha and Ghost because Tasha saw Tariq for who he is. Man, this boy is far gone. He's in the game. I need to teach him. Mhmm. Ghost was still clinging onto the hope that Tariq would go to college and study and be this get this office job, you know. He was still being so naive and all. He didn't understand it up until the end when he was like, you know what? Maybe it's a good thing this boy gets some gets some, you know, real life experience.

42:44KT: That's disgusting.

42:44Oti: Let him go to jail and experience what it is like.

42:44KT: That's disgusting. Kolby,

42:44Oti: was fully with Ghost in the decision of Tariq getting the

42:44KT: We also don't have kids. So you're saying it from a basis of like

42:44Oti: No. Tariq is your kid. Come on now. No. But I'm saying, like, near the end of the series, I never thought because I don't know about everyone out there. I feel like it's universally accepted that Tariq's a shit. But because Ghost became so reckless in that last season, I actually started to like Tariq more.

42:44KT: So let's let's go to you, Kolby. Let's go back to the initial question. What a Kenyan answer.

43:46KT: Go back let's go back to the initial question. Would you, as Ghost, retract your promise of bearing the weight of your son? Meaning, the, you know, the authorities, which you never know where it's going to go, they're gonna do whatever to your son. Kolby, would you like to answer that question?

43:46Kolby: As a parent Mhmm. Kolby would take the weight.

44:09Kolby: As Ghost, in light of recent illuminations from Tariq's shitty character and I will say this, Up until this season, Tariq was probably the most loathsome character that we could think of. Oh, yeah. If anybody said universally, who's the person who wanna punch in the face the most? That little boy. But I will say that I was able to see some things in Tariq that I was like, okay. I'm willing to give this guy some grace. But his willingness to work with Tommy,

44:40Kolby: knowing that Tommy is actively trying to kill his dad, and when Ghost is aware of that, that's what changes his his ultimate, you know, like, what what he's gonna do. I think if that didn't happen and he was still like that innocence was still in Ghost's eye when he looks at Tariq, he would definitely say, I got this done. Like, whatever. Like, no matter what, you're you're my you know? It's like, Yaz is barely there. Like, I almost wanna say, like, you're my last kid. Like, he really is. Yeah.

45:09Oti: That kid never He's gonna grow up with some know what mean?

45:13Kolby: I I really believe that if that if that if that innocence was still there, that he would take it. But what I've seen this this entire series, I'm seeing Ghost really trying to keep Tariq out of this life, and Tariq just, like, wanting it so bad and not having the maturity to see that Ghost is trying to get out.

45:33Kolby: He's not trying to like, the whole, you never a father to me. Don't put your hands on me, man. Don't put your hands on my like, every time it's like, yo, bro, I wanna punch you in the face so bad. Like, he just doesn't get it. He he doesn't get it. So, Because he was I will say that Yep. His ghost ghosts his that lot that strategy doesn't sound sound. It doesn't

45:54Kolby: sound great. You know? Like, oh, we're gonna spin this. Keep in mind. Ray Ray died, like, what, a year ago or almost two by this time? Like, it's been a long time. Like, I'll take it. I'll take the hit now. Nah. So I I don't think the strategy was sound, but I do understand his reason for switching up. But his reason. Like, if I was in that I wouldn't do it because, like, if if my daughter ever came to that, I I yeah. I'd I'd take the bullet for that.

46:19KT: Yeah. And I I volunteer Oti as tribute. He'll take the bullet as well. But I think what you're like, I think what needs to be said is Ghost, Jamie Saint Patrick, or whatever alias like P. Diddy that he wants to live in this particular time is he is the foundation of this show. Not to say he has the he is the be all and end all, but, essentially, if there are cracks in the foundation,

46:51KT: they can kind of lead towards Ghost in some sort of way. He is involved in everything. Let's let's just put it out all on the table. Tariq was brought up in a life of opulence. So he is going to be bratty from the jump. Right? Like, that's just how he is as a character. I don't care for people like that, like those sorts of characters or just people in real life, but fine. Okay. That's his character. What Ghost is not acknowledging

47:21KT: is that he was exactly the same way. As we start to learn in the final season, particularly in the final episode, is that his dad kept calling the police on the boys that he was running with. And he called one too many times, and that's why Ghost's dad died. Right? So Ghost was out there in the streets at that same age. So, yeah, you can say from a point of wisdom,

47:47KT: you know, Tariq, this is not the life for you and that sort of stuff. But who are you? Who are you to say that, really? Right? There's there's another thing about a kid saying shit to their parent that they shouldn't say. But at the end of the day, like, you can't and that's that that is the foundational qualm that I have with Ghost as a character because he didn't acknowledge that people can make mistakes. Like, he doesn't even acknowledge within himself. I don't think he's really reconciled within himself,

48:14KT: and he's even addressed the demons that he has within himself. Because something that I really enjoyed with this show, particularly in the last season, is he he is haunted, if you will, by the ghosts, you know, the like, issues that he hasn't reconciled yet. So you have Angela appearing a lot. Right? And then even oh, it was so good to see Kanan again.

48:42Oti: Speak for yourself, mate.

48:42KT: No. No. It was so good to see him because he was being haunted by that. You you know, it's one of those things. Like, you've you were a person in a previous life and you are who you are now, but that doesn't that doesn't quench all of the shit that you did before. Right? And that's exactly what I loved because he was forced to address it. Right? And you have Kanan, and he said something along the lines of, you need a bullet and a needle.

49:08KT: Right? That's what he said to Ghost because there's some shit that he just hasn't dealt with yet. So, yeah, cool. You wanna go and live a new life with Ramona? That's fine. But like I said before, don't forget about the path of destruction that you laid out before. There's a way to do things, and then there was Ghost's ways of doing things. And they don't in this Venn diagram for KT, they don't converge at all.

49:33Kolby: I could see that. I I I could see that. Like I said, I can't I cannot pacify all of Ghost's actions.

49:41Kolby: I can pacify his motives. Right? And, yes, he's a very I think every person in this show is very selfish. Like, they they're they are all selfish, and Ghost is selfish to a fault. And I think he tries his best to try to reason with it all and, you know, being haunted by his daughter Raina, being haunted by, you know, Angela this season. And then, yeah, that leave a little sprinkle of Kanan. And it's interesting because he's trying to find he he feels like he's close. He feel like he's close to the finish line of what he originally set out to do, you know, from the first season.

50:09Kolby: But as a writer, I know where it was going because I mean, how many times that last episode it says, no one's gonna get in my way. Yeah. What I want It was a bit too on the nose. I felt like they did that to, like, just to progress the storyline. I was like,

50:24Oti: Ghost has been careful so far up to this point, and then he's, like, batting all the bridges down.

50:31KT: Yeah. You knew. It was just like, yeah, just setting up. Just setting it up for some But the interesting thing was he was in every scene. And usually, yes, he is the protagonist, but if you are in every scene of an episode, motherfucker's gonna die. Like, you just Yeah. You just know that they're about to die. And that's exactly, like, what what we were saying, Oti. Like, he was burning all of his bridges in that episode, And it made no sense. And but also at the same time,

51:00KT: we knew there was going to be high payoff emotionally, just being a viewer of Power. We knew someone was going to die. And I think by, like, twenty minutes in, we knew it was going to be Ghost. So it got annoying that we meandered for, like, forty minutes. And it's like, no. And it was it's the last episode, so it was hella long too. So you're like, oh, man. Where are we gonna get to? It was like an hour and a half, I think, but there's five more episodes coming out next year.

51:25KT: Yeah. Yeah. So, anyway, like like, with that finale because you know what? Like, I think I tweeted it as well. There hasn't been many shows that we've been watching in recent years from week to week that has been as thrilling, that has been as satisfying, that has been contributing to the full character development of the protagonist than Power. You know? Yeah. We watch a lot of old shows, but on a week to week basis, aside from that and Snowfall,

51:54KT: I really it's it's really up there in regards to the way they are interweaving the overall narrative of this show. And every episode in this last season has had payoffs, high payoffs. You know, a thank you for coming, and this is the reason why you're continuing to come if you're nasty or to watch this. Right?

52:16KT: And then the finale was just it it felt overdrawn, man. Like, I was like, we know he's gonna die. Like, just get over like, let's get done with it. Because we kind of get it. Like, we it's quite clear why people are gunning for him, literally. Mhmm. Right? But let's let's continue. Let's continue on to some other characters as well. Let's talk a little bit about LaKeisha. She you know what? See? Exactly. And that is audible to the rest of Twitter because you guys are trash. You know?

52:52KT: No. Because, like like, LaKeisha got a lot of hate. Like, she got a lot of hate. I think for the most part, it was because people love Tasha so much, but you guys aren't really following that sort of thought process. But I like, once LaKeisha broke off from Tasha and she tried to become her own person,

53:13KT: I think that's where people were like, nah. I'm done with you. Like, you can die at any time sort of character. But the the problem with Tommy is because he was with Holly and he had such a whirlwind, but he had to, you know, get rid of her, I think he just wanted the opposite. And the problem with him is he shouldn't have brought, like, a civilian into the game. That was his mistake. Because he is so used to being around Tasha, for example, he doesn't realize that, you know, LaKeisha wasn't built for that life.

53:39Kolby: I don't know. Both LaKeisha and Tasha can fall off the back of a truck, in my opinion. They yeah. I don't like, just one, I'll say this. Let me put my critic lens back on.

53:54KT: Oh, that's not what that was. Okay.

53:56Kolby: Yes. I don't know. Was not the sound of me putting glass

53:56KT: It sounds like it sounds like somebody pulling out. Pulling out of Tasha and LaKeisha. There you go.

53:56Kolby: Yo. It's just that so La La Anthony is not a gifted performer. Right? But she tries, and I'll give her, like, an a for effort. Like, she really, really does try. Right? This is her line delivery to me. Like, as a performer, it is really hard and sharp, and it just makes me find her character inauthentic. Like, I do not believe her

54:30Kolby: as this person who she wants to be, and she clearly isn't. Like, I think we're faced with where she's faced with a challenging moment in the end of the sixth season of really trying to go, are you gonna be my ride or die? Are you gonna be? Like, Tommy was looking for a Tasha. Right? Because, obviously, you know, like, that's a really good point. Like, he was looking for Tasha, and he thought that LaKeisha could be that way. And LaKeisha

54:50Kolby: tried to convince herself that she could be that because she likes the life. Like, she got attracted to it. She was fine just being Tasha's friend who can kind of, you know, get some of those, you know, indirect benefits The edge. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Natasha. Yeah. You know what saying? But, like, on her own, just could not handle the weight because if you're gonna be in this life, you have to come to grips with a couple of things. My husband will lie to me.

55:15Kolby: My husband may not be always honorable to me, but he's always gonna make sure that I'm taken care of. And that's one thing that Tommy always made sure that she was taken care of. But she couldn't just she couldn't trust in that alone. There were so many other questions she wanted answers to. And, like, I feel like if you're gonna be in this world, you gotta be fully in it. And she was never fully in it, and she ended up getting what she she got got.

55:39KT: But it wasn't her fault. Like, okay. Maybe her performance wasn't as good, and maybe she's not as seasoned as the other actors on this show. But this show is so good that even her lack of performance doesn't break the camel's back. You know what I mean? Didn't people say that GoFundMe for acting lessons? No. Yeah. They did. See, and Oti knows it because he probably did it.

56:07Kolby: No. That that's that's me picking a nit. But, like, she she was fine. I just the the way that the character ended up going, she feels kinda inconsequential to the story. So it's like, you know, whether she was there or not, like, she would never like, in regards to importance into Tommy's life, she was never gonna be Holly, like, ever. Oh, yeah. Never. Never. I think what Tommy loved about Holly is that she was fully accepting of Tommy.

56:31KT: But she was a fucking criminal as well. Yeah. Like Yes. She Yeah. She was in that life. Tommy needed. I mean, Holly was essentially his mom. Yeah. Exactly. With the red hair and all. Like But that's what I love because in the in the earlier seasons, Ghost makes a comment to, I think, just someone in Truth saying, you know, Tommy has a thing for redheads, but we didn't realize his mom

56:54KT: was a redhead. And then, like, the next scene, they, like, cut to the mom and you're like, oh, he's got mommy issues. Call me mommy one more time, Joseph Sikora. I know you're married, but you're most welcome.

56:54Kolby: Was it I feel like in the early part of the seasons, there was something that was kinda like really weird about their relationship

57:09Kolby: with Tommy and his mom that like I was questioning like, Did you get that?

57:14KT: What specifically? Do you mean like an Oedipus? Because that's delicious.

57:17Kolby: Yes. I love that. I I I thought I was getting that, but it they veered away from it. Yeah. I get what you're saying. I think they didn't have time to address that. She did. Yeah. There was something that she did that was just like, what Like, came over like, he was he must have been drunk, and he, like, he came to the house or something like I don't know. It was not

57:37Kolby: I'm gonna go back and rewatch it just to be able to try to look for that. But but but yeah. So, I mean, you know, LaKeisha's importance to the overall story is just always gonna be below Tasha, below Holly, and definitely, like, below Angela. So, like, she's, you know, she's she's low build in this, you know, just all of her action. Everything that she does is so reactionary.

57:59Kolby: I don't quite understand why she's so upset with Tasha. Like, you didn't know that your best friend was, like, you know, was married to a drug kingpin. Like, come on.

58:09KT: But you know what? Like, LaKeisha was literally a plot device, and that's what made her important. And I think, you know, it it I don't wanna call it a crutch because I love you, Courtney. You're my queen forever and ever. But, you know, in TV shows and also in movies, you have characters that are literally plot devices. They exist just to move the story along, and that's what LaKeisha was. Right? But the importance that she has, particularly near the end of the series, is she actually

58:38KT: potentially gives us a glimpse of who Tommy can be. Because so easily I don't know about you, Kolby, but when we were watching it, I was like, oh, fuck, man. Like, LaKeisha's gonna die. Like, Tommy's going to find out, and he's going to kill her. And he actually didn't. That is growth. Like, I expected I expected him to kill LaKeisha. But I think it it it comes to the, you know, foundational basic human need that Tommy had to be loved.

59:02Oti: Tommy didn't have Ghost, though. That's the difference between when Holly died and this one. But then you have LaKeisha betraying you, and you're like getting all these bullshit lies, you still believed her. If at that moment, LaKeisha didn't die and spilled the beans on Tommy and everything else, I'll be like, you deserve that shit.

59:20KT: Okay. So according to you guys, get rid of all the female characters and all the guys will jerk each other off. Is that what you guys are saying?

59:20Kolby: No. No. No. No. No. We gotta keep Angela. Angela is our favorite.

59:20KT: Yeah. She can wank each other off there as well.

59:38Kolby: From the grave.

59:41KT: There'll be bean She can do it from the grave. Yeah. It'll be produced by Jordan Peele, bean flicking from the grave.

59:49Kolby: No. It's it's like, honestly, like, I think the female characters I don't I'll say this. They don't get a shaft in the story. Like, I really don't Mhmm. Think that they get that at all because the Oh, yeah. I think that even though I have my qualms with Tasha and how she's written, I think there's not a lot of characters in TV that are written that way. I think for Naturi and this character, there's a lot I don't wanna say there's lot of women that could see their self in that, but this

60:21Kolby: it's it's it's it's another, like, it's another great representational step that we can have stories that while the protagonist is Ghost, like, she is a amazing supporting player in the story. Like, you can't remove her. Like, I can remove LaKeisha, but I cannot remove Tasha because, like, Tasha really is trying. And, like, you can you can honestly vibe with her in a lot of ways. Like, she's selfish as well,

60:46Kolby: but no matter what, she wanted to hold she wanted to hold it down for Ghost. Like, if Ghost just said, you know what? I wanna be with you and nobody else. Like, there was nothing that was gonna, like, deter her from that. I think that her philandering only became as a, you know, as a consequence of Ghost's

61:02Kolby: extramarital affairs. Like, I I I don't there's when I look at Tasha, she's not a cheater because, like, oh, she just she wants something else than Ghost. No. No. She Ghost didn't want her, so she was free to want other things. And I think it's absolutely fine. And, like, I I like how devoted she was to Tariq. And I will say as a parent, I think it's questionable to say, you know what? I'm gonna go in, and I'm gonna teach you the game at seventeen.

61:26KT: Hang on. Okay. Let's talk about this because this is a big discussion point.

61:31KT: Okay. Tasha,

61:32KT: as a parent, saw Tariq well, she knew Tariq was trash from the jump, but she pretends that he's a cute little boy, but he's not. Right?

61:42KT: But she sees and you know what? It's actually there, but she chose to see it because you know what? Ghost actually chose not to see the flaws in Tariq. He just kept seeing him the way he wanted to see him. But Tasha took all of that off and she saw Tariq for the kid that he was. He was constantly getting in drug trouble. He was dealing drugs at Choate. Like, he just didn't want to be legit. Right? And that's just the way he was. So Tasha, as a mother, had to make a decision. Right?

62:14KT: Do I pretend that he's gonna go off to college and be fine and live a legit life? Or do I acknowledge that maybe it's not the best decision, but this is what he wants to do right now? I'm gonna teach him how to do it the right way.

62:30Kolby: I think a dialogue with your son in honesty would have been a better start. Hey, son. Regardless of how your entry point was into this game, your dad and I, we got into it for very specific reasons. It's because we didn't have. This is new. You do have. So let's have an honest conversation about what is it that the drug game is like, what is it that you're attracted to about it? You know? Do you believe it's gonna afford you something that you don't have already?

62:59Kolby: It clearly isn't a matter of, like, resources. Like, he has whatever he wants. Like, he has a penthouse apartment that he could be able to live in, going to a very nice school. So what is it? What is attracting you? Is it is it is power that you're looking for? Do you want you know? Like, there's other things that he's in search of that nobody's willing to have a conversation about. So I I understand what you're saying, but also at the same time, that that discussion should have been had a long time ago.

63:23KT: But the family wasn't ready to address it because he's already, you know, been in the ranks with Kanan. Like, he's already been and done and seen shit.

63:36Kolby: So that Are we gonna talk about the other shit in the room? Oti? As a writer, I want you guys to know, did we not think in season two or three when Kanan, like, came on the scene Mhmm. And that is not Kanan's kid.

63:52KT: You know what? I actually never thought of that. Oh. No. Come on. Are you serious?

63:58Oti: I didn't think of Eva.

64:01Kolby: Think about all the hate that Tasha has towards It's it's not proportionate. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Are we are we not gonna like this is Kanan's kid. Like, the only thing that messes it up, and I feel like the writers probably they wrote they wrote themselves into all of this, is that they made Raina and him twins. Now unless we're gonna believe that Kanan was responsible for both because that will absolutely kill Ghost. If Ghost finds a way to survive what happens to him in the end of this last episode and

64:30Kolby: that will kill him. That'll give him a heart attack. He will die if he finds out that Kanan is the father of Raina and Tariq. Because there's so many things as to to try to explain Tariq's nature. He is so much like Kanan. And, obviously, it just makes sense. And if you wanna get super Shakespearean about it, that would make plenty of sense.

64:50KT: But are we are we painting Ghost to be some sort of, like, angel? His name is Ghost because motherfuckers don't see him coming or going. But that's no. But he like, we're acting as if he's some sort of, like, kitty cat, but he's not.

65:09Kolby: Yeah. But you could see a difference just in their nature. You know? That Ghost has an appeal to a Ghost seems fully aware of and maybe because he's been in the game for so long that, okay, I know what I want in the game. It's not the thing that's gonna provide me with that. It'll provide me with happiness, like that instant gratification because I'm getting, like, quick money, stuff like that, but not joy, which joy is everlasting.

65:34Kolby: And I think that's a conversation I would have with my son. Like, yo. You know, what do you what do you want? Kanan, like, just like with Tommy, Tommy doesn't aspire to want anything more than just the game. There's an attraction of the game that Tariq has, and that would have been a little bit more interesting to explore. And I hear that, I guess, that is a possibility for a spin off that we're gonna actually see this evolution of Tariq.

65:58Oti: Bloody hell. He was a Tariq spin off. I'm just saying. I'm I'm throwing that it out. Will be

66:05KT: Tariq because he is a younger generation as well, so they can build on that over a couple of years as well. Yeah. Courtney was mentioning in regards to fucking hell. Stop calling things universes.

66:20KT: It really pisses me off. But, again, I love you, Courtney. But you'll saw you about in regards to the Power universes, there's actually going to be a few sort of spin offs. Whether they exist in the same show or there's gonna be, like, mini shows, she mentioned that there's gonna be a few, and one of them might even be a character that isn't alive anymore. But I definitely feel like Tariq is going to be at the foundation of one of them because he is the youngest. Right?

66:44Kolby: Mhmm.

66:45KT: As long as, like, Dre is not in it,

66:48Kolby: Wow. Can we

66:48Oti: That guy's a cockroach.

66:48KT: You're not a Dre fan. Kolby,

66:54KT: are you a Dre fan?

66:56Kolby: I'm in bet I'm I'm a little mixed on Dre.

66:56KT: Dre is a vomit forever.

66:56Kolby: For real?

67:05KT: He is just like Oti said, he's like a cockroach. He always manages to survive. And he's like a cockroach, but also he's like a snake because you actually don't know who he is as a person. He will be whatever he needs to be to be able to survive that moment.

67:22Kolby: That's very true. Yep.

67:24KT: So it's just like you just never know where you stand with this guy, and you could never trust him. Like, even, you know, throughout the series, people it became abundantly clear that you just couldn't trust Dre. There are times where you might need to use him, but use him at your own detriment because you don't know where that's going to go. Because you know he's going to call the FBI a second after you leave. Like He's a super plot device.

67:50Kolby: He's been implicated, like, in so many different ways. Like, he should just he should just take up a residence at that f that federal building. Just just stay there.

67:58KT: Yeah. It's like, I'm sure he's got someone else to snitch on. Like, he's always got something he can, you know, weasel himself out of. But Dre was a problem. Like, Dre was a problem, and I feel like he he's got enough time, unless there's anything else you guys wanna say about Dre. No. In this instance let's forget about Dre in this instance. Right? Hello. My mixtape is dropping next summer. Okay. So we've talked a bit about Angela and, you know, however we feel about her character. But let's spend some time talking about Paz,

68:33KT: who is her sister, who also we already said spoilers, but if you're in for the ride, strap in and also strap on for some spoilers because Paz was also one of the people walking towards Truth.

68:45Kolby: And I don't get her. Like Seven seven people walking. We had Tommy. Well, we don't know. We didn't get a shot of, like, Tommy and Truth. We just see Tommy walking. Right? Yep. We got Tommy. We got Tate. We got Paz. We got Saxe. We've got, Tariq, and then we've got Rodriguez. And Tasha. I feel like I'm and Tasha. So, yeah, the seven. Paz, I thought that she was good with Ghost.

69:14Kolby: But then I guess after that final meeting, which Ramona was, like, spying in on, I guess not she didn't she didn't hear what she wanted to hear.

69:14KT: Yeah. No. But it's like, you know, in in a lot of, like, TV shows, and I guess if you wanna get real as well,

69:28KT: that was the dropping of the pin where she realized, you know what? I I left it in the hands of the authorities, but they're not going to do it. So I'm going to put it in my own hands now.

69:40Oti: But what does she not get that ghosting kill Angela?

69:43KT: It doesn't matter. Right? What we need to remember is context. Context is very important because Paz is the older sister of Angela. Right? So she never wanted Angela messing with Ghost ever. So From when they were kids. Yeah. So, yes, he he might not have been the one to kill Angela, but if if she didn't get caught up in his world, this wouldn't have happened. So she's always and you know what? And it's family as well. So it's it's irrational, but she's always going to blame Ghost anyway. So at least you can understand that.

70:19KT: Watch out for my sister. My sister comes strapped up going.

70:27Oti: I don't know. I I just felt like she was cleaning her straws there just to find someone to blame and Ghost was it. Angela was old enough to make her decisions. And she was succinctly like, Angela was so clear about her love for Ghost with her. And the fact that she still takes it as if Ghost is to blame for all this as if Angela didn't know anything she was

70:27KT: She felt like she had to protect her. Whether it was right or wrong,

70:53KT: that was where she was coming from.

70:56Oti: Yeah. Maybe so. But she was the least she was the last person in that walk walk up that was like, if if she ends up to be the one that shot Ghost, I'd be so pissed.

70:56KT: So this is interesting. This is where we move into a life lesson, kids, of hypocrisy.

71:12KT: So we talk about Paz, and you don't understand how she would do that. But how about Ghost?

71:12Oti: How about Ghost what?

71:12KT: Ghost did the same thing.

71:12Oti: To who?

71:12KT: I'm not gonna we're going to talk after this Oti because we talk about Paz and how she's blinded by all of this. Right? Yeah. And everything else in regards to Ghost character, you're absolutely fine with.

71:12Oti: Not that I'm fine with. I understand.

71:12KT: Even him throwing Tariq under the bus.

71:12Oti: Yes. Tariq is terrible.

71:12KT: But there are some qualms you need to reconcile, my love. Because you can you can you can you can understand it in other characters, but not in Ghost.

71:45Oti: No. Because it's so easy for everyone to just blame Ghost for everything that's wrong in their lives, Tasha included. He's the protagonist. Yes. Fine. Ghost has done some horrible shit. But out of all of those bloody people, he's the only one that's trying to make Claff better for himself.

72:02KT: Yeah. But you can't lay a foundation until you've destructed the other one. You know what I mean? You love talking about foundations, and that's exactly it.

72:14Kolby: It's very interesting the way you put that. I I mean, I I can see it. I just think that her rationale is off. I can understand her, like, always having contempt towards Jamie. You know? She will blame Jamie forever. No matter if Jamie didn't pull the trigger or not Mhmm. She will blame Jamie for her sister's death. But to then say, okay. The law is not gonna work in my favor that I need to resort to possibly killing this man. Like, this is where, like, hurt her wrong and hit, like you know, it's all too wrongs to make it right? Well, that wrong doesn't seem close to right at all because it's still not gonna give her any satisfaction,

72:48Kolby: like, at all. You know? I would, like, I would hold the gun to Jamie and said, I demand you to tell me who did this. And if I gotta, like, shoot you in a couple of different places, but not kill you. Like, because that's ultimately what she wanted. If she were like, if if if Jamie wanted to go ahead and just, like, roast Tommy and give her that information,

73:06Kolby: which I almost thought that he would. Mhmm. It was Tommy that did. You know? Just to give her, like, that piece to see what she would do with it. Because at that point, he was done with Tommy. Like, he could've he he already he stick, you know, Benny on Itami. Like, just yo. Just go ahead and just he was burning down all the bridges. So why not give give him that? You know? But I guess he was really thinking that knowing would not give her any peace.

73:30Kolby: And I think it would have been really interesting if that's something that Ramona would have heard, like, how that would have set things in motion for the rest of the episode. But, yeah, like, what harm would it have done just to say Tommy did it and see what she would have did?

73:42KT: That would have been pretty interesting. If there was a gun to Ghost's head, he would probably say it was Tariq.

73:52Oti: Wow. You really don't like Ghost, do you?

73:54KT: No. But he was ready for his son to go to jail and whatever happened

74:01KT: to his kid. He didn't care because he was going to go off with Ramona and start his own family. He did not give one iota of a fuck for Tariq.

74:01Kolby: But you didn't think that Ghost would have been inaugurated, let's say, in, like, three to six months, and then ultimately would have, like, shaved down his sentence or whatever like that with his son. You know? I feel I think that's what Ghost really thought. But it's like, no, man. But, like, as a parent, I guess as generations get older, they're more,

74:30Kolby: you know, they're more in tune with their self interest because, you know, like my parents or even my grandparents, they're, like, super OG. Like, I couldn't imagine a world where my parents or my grandparents would feed into their own self interest. It was also it was always about the family and what's best for the family. But I guess now that people are getting older and people are becoming more conscious,

74:50Kolby: these generations where you have Ghost, it's like, nah, I wanna live a new life. I wanna forget about you. Because I can never imagine a situation generations back that you would have a parent not aiding that charge. I'm not saying he should have done it, but I just don't understand as a parent how you would be okay with your child suffering in jail. Mhmm. Like, that's what I just can't understand. It seemed like he should have exhausted a lot more resources to devise a plan that would keep him out of jail.

75:18Kolby: And it seemed like he was just kinda like, you know what? I think I've tried enough. And I I get that part. And and I think that's that's something just to do with, like, the construction of the series that it was the last episode. We have to find a way to try to tie up this part. We need to really drive a wedge between him and Tariq, so this is the way to do it. I would have, like, spent days and night to say, okay. How can I pin this on Dre? This and everything ends up being pinned on Dre. Like, how can I get this on somebody other than myself? These guys are the kings and queens of, like, slipping into places. I I didn't know breaking into, like, hotels and stuff was so easy, but they make it seem like it's the easiest thing to do in this world. Like, everybody

75:52Kolby: the one thing I love about this world, it is so easy to break into places. And apparently, just all of New York has so much money to buy drugs all day every day. Like, I lived in Yonkers. I didn't have a lot of money. But let me tell you something. I I thought that if you obviously, if you buy drugs, you're, like, you're you're using and, like, that's all where your money is going to.

76:11Kolby: How often do we see throughout this series? Like, when they needed to come up with money, they could just move weight so quick. Like, yeah. Drugs. We need the drugs now. Where does that money come from to buy the drugs? We need $1,000,000 today.

76:22KT: Let me go and sell drugs for one day and get a million dollars.

76:26Kolby: A million dollars. I swear it is. Oh, man. But yeah, no, you're right. It's Paz needed someone to give her that that that that I can't even say fulfillment, but just to to give her peace. And if killing Jamie's gonna give her that, then, hey, that'll be that instant gratification, but then she's not gonna get any joy from it.

76:49KT: Yeah. She's gonna come to realize that that didn't fulfill whatever she was looking to fill. But it it's definitely like, when you're red hot in the moment, it's it's not gonna mean anything trying to appeal to people rationally. Right? But let's talk about it. Let's let's talk about the ending scene. Right? So so we've already talked about Paz. Let's talk about Cooper Saxe.

77:14Oti: Yo.

77:16Kolby: This guy. I I thought he was gonna be some throwaway character, some little side character, and he really became, like, a major player in the story.

77:22KT: I did not say that much. Well, it's like, you know, with with any sort of good story, you need to have, like, a villain. So whenever, you know, Ghost wasn't the overarching villain or Tommy wasn't the villain, you kinda just slipped in Cooper Saxe. Just like he was the one to hate, like, in that moment. And, you know, Courtney also mentioned

77:46KT: that the FBI kinda served as the And Then There Were None series by Agatha Christie. Like, they just kept dropping off like flies. Oh, they did?

77:55Oti: Yeah. Yeah. Actually.

77:57KT: And and, again, like we're saying, all of the good people are the ones that died, but Cooper Saxe remained because he was a trash person. He always managed he always managed to crawl out of the nuclear explosions that he was causing around him. But I feel like you can't talk about Cooper Saxe without talking about Joe Proctor as well. Right? Oh, throw it out for Joe. Yeah. Right? Let's let's let's pour some sugar on the concrete for him. Jerry Ferrara, I never watch Entourage because he's an Entourage. Right?

78:27Kolby: You

78:28Kolby: you're gonna change that. Right?

78:30KT: I don't know. I I I guess we'll see. Like, unless you're telling me that it's got good writing.

78:30Kolby: It is one of the greatest TV series of all time.

78:30KT: Says the guy that hasn't watched Power The Wire. Sorry.

78:30Kolby: Touche.

78:30KT: But, yeah, just to go back to my point, like, I don't know. I just I I always disregarded. If I had seen their faces in Entourage, I'm like, I I I just disregarded them, essentially. Right? I didn't spend much time thinking about them, but but if they appeared in things that I watched,

79:01KT: I just didn't care for them. But seeing him in Power, I really enjoyed, you know, Jerry Ferrara's portrayal of Joe Proctor. Yeah. For sure. He's really likable in this. I found myself wanting him not to die. But he was really he was rolling in, you know, he was rolling in the dirt with Ghost and Tommy.

79:23Oti: Yeah. He he's crooked as they come, but at least Yeah. At least he knew which side his bread is buttered. You know? Mhmm. And the fact that when he needed someone somewhere to crash, he went to crash at Ghost's house just tells you everything you needed to about their relationship. And it's just sad that he died in that house.

79:42Kolby: Yeah. Yeah. I don't that wasn't a good decision. I don't know why people just like don't leave New York. Just leave New York. Like, it's very easy. Like, it costs you $20 to get on the bridge. Just go. Please just go. But so yeah. I I I like Proctor a lot. I'm a big Jerry Ferrara fan. My LA story was very much like Entourage. So that that's why I connect so much to that show. Mhmm. When I saw him here, he's so likable. He's very charismatic.

80:12Kolby: And shout out to short actors. Like we need more of you on screen all the time. And Joe, if you're gonna be a lawyer in New York and the moment that you commit to take that one case to defend that one guy, unfortunately, you have looped yourself into a world that you have to play by those rules, and there's really no way to get out of it. So he had to play all sides. And, unfortunately, he got got. You know? Like, Tommy canceled Christmas on his ass, and it was

80:46Kolby: man, it's it sucked. I I I didn't think it was gonna go out just like that, but, yeah, it's sad to see him go, man. He was he was he was fun to have. You know? But

81:00KT: But when you when you were existing within that realm, it's not a question of if, it's a question of when. Yep. True. Very true. Yeah. And it is a very limited time. The way that he went out was very excessive. Like, it was very, like, Scarface. Like, just it was overkill. Like, I think was it Tariq coming back to the blaze being like, what happened here? It's yeah. It it just seemed a bit excessive, but, you know, it's Tommy. Right? So

81:31KT: what else are you going to what else are you going to expect from him? But let let's loop back to Cooper Saxe. He is a dirty person. Right? And it's like, you know, sometimes it's fun to see renegades and, like, authorities. Like, you know, Jimmy McNulty in The Wire is like that as well, where you see people just blowing past bureaucracy and the red tape, and they do questionable things, but they get the job done. Right? From that point of view, it's fun. But watching Cooper Saxe, we're actually rooting for people away from authorities.

82:05KT: But he was he was grimy as the people he was trying to catch. Right? What do you think I would be pissed off personally if he's the one that, like, hits Ghost, but I don't think it would be because that would be very annoying.

82:22Oti: It would be annoying. I don't think it will be him either. I thought I'd liked crooked cops who would just do everything to get the job done. But him doing that, like you said, just really didn't feel right.

82:30KT: Was It depends on who the protagonist is of the show. Yeah. Because you there's also that new one. Is it City on a Hill with Kevin Bacon? And he's kinda like that as well. Yeah. So it depends on which part of the story you wanna be on.

82:48Kolby: Right? I I I think that's, like, the justice conversation. It's like, justice isn't meant to be ideally, in an an ideal sense, it's meant to be, like, fair and balanced and to, you know, to be, you know, swift, but, like, justice isn't that. Justice is however which way you can bend towards whichever side that you're on. And Cooper Saxe and and a lot of the other US attorneys, they want to see the bad guys go away, but they know that the framework in which they're allowed to dispense justice makes it very easy

83:22Kolby: for justice to not be served. So in order for them to succeed, they have to operate outside of that.

83:29KT: And it just seems like the good guys are always the one to get caught doing bad things. Just don't get caught. If if you're going to do shit to try and get, like, the criminals, just don't get caught and it's fine. Yeah.

83:41Kolby: They just will forever get in their own way. And I gotta tell you, though. Shout out. Like, he he wasn't an an MVP of of this season, but the guy that took over for for Tamika, the dude that was on Sex and City, the bald dude. The bald dude. Yeah. Was a just like my wife caught like a couple like episodes that I was rewatching it. And just like, you did fucking what? Your level of incompetency is just baffling. I'm gonna have you in handcuffs. Are you fucking kidding me? The

84:17Kolby: entire season, it was just so great. He's just like, what fuck did I get into? It's it was really, really good.

84:24KT: Well, I guess I I guess it depends who you have at the helm. And at that particular point, you know, they were led by someone that just wanna know bullshit, full transparency, and we're gonna do everything by the book. Right?

84:36Oti: But that later changed because he became complicit in everything that was happening with Cooper Saxe as well. The fact that they went to get the phone that he planted there, he still presented it as evidence to get Ghost.

84:50KT: So Yeah. Everyone turned at the end. I guess so. Are we also forgetting that Dre was approaching Truth as well? Oh, Dre was there as well. Yeah. I don't know if we want it because we already talked about Dre.

85:02Kolby: Damn. How did I miss? I forgot about Dre.

85:05KT: You forgot about Dre.

85:08Kolby: That's right. Because he got he got out. I for damn it. This guy, this slippery mother

85:14KT: It is slippery. Oh my god. If there's a series and he's at the helm of it, I do not want to watch it.

85:20Kolby: You know it. Ew. I'd prefer Dre over Tariq any day all day. I I I prefer Dre. You know, I I I where where Dre was in the middle season when when he had aspirations to try to be Ghost and, you know, take over Truth and stuff like that. Like, I I I I actually I like that because I saw him trying to aspire to, like, do something different. But then afterwards, if he got messed up, you know, with the, with that with that cartel,

85:45Kolby: with the Jimenez, Like, I was like, ah, okay. He got he got kinda reduced back to, like, what he was, you know, in the beginning of the series. I wouldn't I wouldn't mind that.

85:52KT: But but, yeah, Saxe cannot be the trigger man for this. I I think I I'd rebel. So, like, just going back to Dre, like, it okay. If he because it looked like he was being groomed to become the next Ghost. Right? Mhmm. I had a problem with that. And the reason why I had a problem with that is he didn't work for it. He didn't earn it. So I was like, no. You

86:18KT: don't you dare. And he was so slippery and he was so conniving at at at the turn of a coin, he would bend.

86:25Oti: But you know why he him being at the helm of it will interesting? Because you really don't know what you're gonna get with Dre. We don't really know what drives him at all other than protecting his daughter at what whatever cost. Yeah. But he didn't really care about his daughter. He just wanted to save himself.

86:41Kolby: I said it. I said it. I got no. I I got that to say. It's the the daughter thing seemed like a crutch because she didn't really come up until he had to go into WITSEC. So I was like,

86:53Kolby: yeah. It's like you could've seen your daughter any other time.

86:57Kolby: There was nothing there was nothing stopping you. And as a father, like, I'd want my daughter out of harm's way, and I have, like, people from all sides of my world trying to kill me. I don't want my daughter anywhere near that. Oh, yeah. But it'll it'll just be interesting because he's so he's so different from Ghost.

86:57KT: You are really holding on to this.

87:17KT: Well, hello, listeners. Thank you for continuing to listen to us. Be ready for For Your Rotimis.

87:28KT: Oti will be having his own podcast.

87:28Oti: Is that how you pronounce his name? Rotimi? Yeah. Rotimi. Plus the fact that he He sings can he can sing the intro.

87:36KT: Oh. Actually, Kolby, let's talk about that. Did you did you hear about the controversy about Trey Songz, them switching up the season six intro?

87:36Kolby: Yes. So

87:49Kolby: I did not watch the season right when it started. Felt I was behind by, like, a few weeks just with a lot of stuff. So I heard about the the controversy of it. And then when I go back to my Starz app to, like, start watching, they removed it completely.

88:03Oti: Oh, really?

88:04Kolby: Yeah. Like, it's not in there at all. It's always like, every every episode, it is the original. So, like, they it's just taken out.

88:13KT: Because and and and, again, we do love Trey Songz, you know, as as we said at the start of this episode. But, also, for five seasons, it was Joe, and Joe needs to be appreciated, and people need to know about Joe. Right? Mhmm. I wanna know what turns you on, as said by Joe. Joe came to Kenya, like, when we were in Kenya years ago, so he has a soft spot even though Oti always gives me shade because the guitarist asks me backstage, but that's a story for another day.

88:45Kolby: Oh.

88:49KT: But it's like, why would you do that? Like, for five seasons, you had this intro, and then you just randomly changed it. Why would you do that? Like, it was better in the last episode when they changed when they changed up the arrangement of the song. Like, that's that was more poignant.

88:49Kolby: Oh, like at the end?

88:49KT: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And Ghost was shot in the same place that Angela was shot, which was in the heart. Vomit. But yes. Very romantic.

89:17KT: Well, it's good you can see your future because that's what's gonna happen to you and your high school sweetheart. Other people that were at the moment of truth. We also had councilman Tate, which it makes sense that we haven't talked about him because he only came up in the last couple of seasons, but let's spend some time talking about Tate. Do you think about him? Another short actor. Because he and he's also one of those guys, and he's, like, 40, but he looks 20. Like, he moisturizes Yeah. Right?

89:49KT: But he so he was a cop, but it seems like he has a lot of street sensibilities that we just didn't get to see in this series.

89:58Kolby: Yeah. Yeah. He seemed very wrapped up into his, you know, into his councilman, you know, persona that it's it was only, like, really serving in a couple of moments. Like, I forgot that he was a cop until, like, the news mentioned it, like, after the Truth shooting at the nightclub. I was like, oh, he was a cop? I I yeah. I guess so. I'm I'm wondering why if they're, like, from the same area, like, why they never ran into each other before. Like Mhmm. How come he doesn't know who Ghost is?

90:27Kolby: And it seems like there's so many people who could flip on Ghost and, like, like, really tell, like, who he is that just it never comes out at all. Like, Ghost can't like, deals with a lot of people and just no one ever decides to, like, say anything. But I I like the back and forth between, you know, Tate and Ghost. Like, I I that power dynamic, he was really interesting. And Tate also could not get out of his way of his own lust and his

90:57Kolby: screwing his, I guess, was a secretary? I didn't know that she was married at first. Thought they were just dating, but like, she was married.

91:05KT: She had a very vanilla marriage.

91:07Kolby: Oh, very, very, very much so. I love those little short backhanded comments that she was making, like, towards her husband. But, yeah, I I'm surprised that he is on the the war path for Ghost because I think he still has some stake in the game if he plays it right.

91:28KT: It it's it's interesting that he would take that route. But it's also there's a lot of ego when it comes to not just politics, but even with Tate's character. So the fact that Ghost continually one upped him, right,

91:42Kolby: even to the point where he, you know, he swapped beds. See, you're you're a loser. He said, you're a loser. I I you'd like losing. I I could tell. Like, he was he was really giving it to me in that last scene when they were talking. Knew. Yeah. What what was Tate gonna say? Like, I feel like he was gonna say something about Tariq, and I don't know what it was.

92:01KT: Yeah.

92:03Kolby: He was about to say something and then Ghost came back again. It was like, yeah. You know what? Get used to losing. Get used to like, I'm like, oh, alright, Ghost. Jump out my dude. Let

92:12Kolby: the guy finish.

92:13KT: But, yeah, every everyone definitely had their motives, but you can see with councilman Tate, like, he was legit, and he he's like a politician, but you can see he's he's has his own story. Right? Mhmm. And that actually might be quite interesting to dive into as well. But, you know, like, Ghost had this superiority complex where he just looked down on people, including councilman Tate, which whether through dirt or through legitimacy, he he rise through the ranks to become councilman. Right?

92:46KT: Mhmm. And Ghost never really acknowledged that sort of achievement. He's like, yeah, whatever. I'm going to do what I'm going to do. You're trash sort of thing. Right? So there's definitely motive around there. Let's let's just go through, like, personally for ourselves, who who do we want to be? Well, first of all, I'm going to acknowledge that Ghost does get shot and he's dead. Who do we want? Who do we want to be the person that shot Ghost? And who do we think because it might not be the same. Kolby?

93:23Kolby: Oh, it's gotta be Tariq. It would be almost poetic that Ghost feels partly responsible for his father's death and that Tariq would be directly responsible for his father's death.

93:38KT: And that's who you want to shoot, Ghost?

93:42Kolby: That's who I want. I think it makes sense narratively to have that be it. Obviously, he's the person with the most to lose. Like literally, his father has said that he's going to pressure you into turning yourself into the cops to make you implicate that you killed this man, which you did, but you did do in a crime of passion. And after you put your hands on my mom and I, however, wrongly blame you for like all the issues in my life.

94:13Kolby: Yeah, I'm gonna make a decision that you need to be removed from my life. That's who I want, and that's who I think will be. Oti.

94:22Oti: I wanted to be Tommy. Nice. I really just wanted to be Tommy because I don't think anyone else deserves to be able to shoot Ghost.

94:22KT: It took this long for me to agree with you. Like, this is the point.

94:22Oti: Really do want it to be Tommy, but I feel like it will be Tariq just because there was this last scene that they had with Ghost. Yeah. And I felt like Tariq was just about to pull a gun out and shoot Ghost in the head. If he had one. Yeah. Exactly. And it did happen.

94:54Oti: So I think that's why they'll go with it, especially if they're grooming him to be the lead of this spin off thing.

94:59KT: I have two. So I definitely want Tommy to be there because for so long, you know, Tommy is, like, not even trying to you know, he's not even in the race with Ghost in regards to Ghost ambitions. Right? But constantly, Ghost was, like, pushing Tommy down and, like, constantly barraging him and, you know, just really petty sort of shit. And the fact that you know, even to the fact that he loved Holly so much, but he got rid of her because of his loyalty to Ghost. That's just a full on comeuppance.

95:38KT: Father that for Ghost as well. Tony Teresi. And we haven't even talked about that as well. Actually, let's talk about that just quickly. I don't know. That's where I saw the undoing of Ghost. Like, that's because he is entirely selfish. And if you guys love Power, feel free to tweet us where Ghost made a decision that wasn't entirely self serving to himself.

96:02Kolby: Because at that moment, it's just like, wow. He really doesn't care for Tommy the way that Tommy cares for him. Yeah. The the the Teresi thing, when I was explaining that to my wife, I was like, yeah. So so let's say, he killed, you know, love his life. And, like, he killed hers, but he also convinced his dad. You know, he commits him to kill his dad or he, like, he manipulated him. And, like, Ghost's explanation to Tommy felt so, like, cold and just like, wait. He said it so kind of nonchalant. He's like, yeah. I had to do it because he's become a problem. He's gonna snitch on us. I'm like, wow.

96:35Kolby: Like, nah. Even though, yes, he Tommy just found out that Tony was his dad. And if I'm trying to remember now, Tony was definitely gonna snitch on them both. Yep. Right? Or was he really was he was he honestly having a change of heart? No. I I think he would've snitched. On both of them. Okay. Because he he really didn't care about Tommy. He was just like, yeah, that's Kate's kid or whatever. And he just want to make sure to take care of his wife. His wife was dying of cancer. Yeah. So I mean,

97:05Kolby: Tony got what he deserved, but to have it come from like your son, like that's yeah. And then have Ghost be, like, really, really a part of that. That was kinda wack. So yeah. No. Tommy Tommy Tommy taking the shot seems it would only seem right if Tommy was gonna replace Ghost. But because I know that he's not, I'd I'd I feel like I would need more from it. And that's why I feel like it would make more sense for Tariq because Tariq would ultimately try to, like, step in as the new Ghost.

97:34KT: Yeah. He's definitely whether he's going to become Ghost, but he's definitely going to be the like, at the helm of whatever sort of universe they're going to introduce in regards to Power. So I think Tariq is the one that's going to be, you know, who's going to shoot Ghost. But if it's not going to personally, if it's not going to be Tommy that's going to shoot Jamie Saint Patrick or whatever you wanna call him, you know what I'm going to say, Tasha. It's gotta be. For all of those years, long suffering is the underlined,

98:11KT: italic, bolded word in red. Like, come on now. Like, whatever you feel about Tasha's character, she had to go through a lot. Yes. She was dripping in diamonds and Gucci and whatever you wanna say, but that didn't take away from the fact that at the end of the day, she had her kids and she she was right there with Ghost and she was living that life with him. So say what you wanna say, but that would be a very nice, sort of rounding off. And you know what? Even you know what was really heartbreaking?

98:46KT: Yes. Tasha had her little side pieces with Sean and also Terry Silver, which Ghost is not a full man because he says he doesn't want Tasha, but then he he, like, goes and eliminates all of them. You know what I mean? Like, you can't dip your dick in all the pies. Okay? That's a For Your Reference phrase of mine. But you know what I mean? It's just like, okay. So Tasha did try, but there were more side pieces than, like, genuine suitors. Right? But in it, whatever it was,

99:16KT: she really tried her best. But I don't know if she felt like I feel like her love for Ghost was gone, but it became real in the last episode where he's like, I release you from this marriage. And you could actually see the heartbreak in her face. Maybe, emotionally, she's not in love with Ghost anymore, but that became, you know, the needle dropping for her.

99:40Kolby: Well, I think it's because she realized that her world was ultimately over. She tried to step out and have her own business, and it's a lot harder than what she probably gave it credit for. And Ghost was always gonna be an easy out, and it was self serving to the both of them to still keep up the marriage for the press to help, you know, Jamie with his goop lieutenant gubernatorial chances.

100:05Kolby: But, like, one, the way he says it's like, I release you from this marriage. Like, it was like some some some magic bail that was, like, removed or something like that. It was funny. Yo. Let me tell you something. The way that he mushed her with that finger. My gosh. Did you see the The memes are amazing. That was the deepest I felt that. Was like, because let me tell you something. I I I've I've never been mushed like that in my life. I gosh. But, yes, she

100:35Kolby: her world came crashing down knowing what he was intent on doing, making Tariq confess to the murder of Ray Ray, him going fully legit and, like, saying, like, yeah, the marriage is absolutely done. And she also knows that she's not gonna get anything from him. Like, she doesn't have any leg up in regards to, like, the

100:53Kolby: the lawyer stuff with the divorce and everything like that, that everything that she's ever known is going to be gone. She's gonna lose her son for however many times. She's not gonna have, you know, Jamie around anymore. It's just gonna be her, her mama, and that other kid that we don't ever talk about.

101:10KT: Well, who knows? They might be at the end of the start of it. I don't think Cash is going to get any sort of airtime. I think that's kind of the end of Cash until if they're going to build a universe, he'll probably come back, like, years later and hopefully shoot Tariq. For periods of time, you didn't even thought LaKeisha forgot about Cash anyway. So

101:30Kolby: Yeah. What a weird cameo for was it Jesse Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, I was like, oh, that was really quick and just random.

101:38KT: Mhmm. And as we're mentioning cameos, also shout out to Kendrick Lamar for being Laces.

101:43Kolby: Oh, yo. That was really, really good. Yeah. Did he get did he get a nomination for, like, a for an Emmy for that? That was a really good performance. It was really good. He did that very well.

101:54KT: But every anything Kendrick does, I'm just going to praise forever.

101:59Kolby: Yeah. That was really, really good. Yeah. No. Cash is I forgot I forgot that she had a kid. I didn't know he was that kid. I think even she forgot she had a kid.

102:09KT: Because she was she was out there with her ass out with Tommy on the couch. I'm like, where's your kid, mate? Like, is he taking notes for the future? Like, where's your kid? Like, where is he? That that would be, like, the next but I, like, just going back, I said it as a joke, but, genuinely, as they're expanding this universe, I want Cash to come back and shoot Tariq. Oh my gosh. Really want that to happen. Oh, but that's interesting. It's it's interesting. And you know what? It comes back on January 5,

102:45KT: so it's not far away. Oh, that's good. Especially in this day and age where we've got lots of TV shows and movies to keep us satiated until then. But then we've got five more episodes, and it's going to round out Power.

102:58Kolby: I'm excited. I'm ready. I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm definitely ready. I wanna see what the conclusion is. I wanna see if they're actually gonna commit to having Ghost be gone. It's gonna be interesting because I thought I thought Angela was gone, and then she was still in every episode this season, which is great because I Lela Loren, my gosh. Yeah. I just I the love story means the most to me inside this entire series, the love story between Jamie and Angela.

103:29Kolby: Everything else is great, but that love story is paramount to how I connect to it Because I had an Angela in my life. Just like somebody you just cannot get rid of. And even when you got something good, it can just go in and just screw up everything for you. And I love those type of stories that really do

103:47Kolby: play with that. I think at the crux, us being human, we're so vulnerable to our emotions, and it's just it's something that they couldn't quit each other even though how bad they were for each other for a lot of different reasons. So, I hope that they do if Ghost gets got I mean, where that bullet was, I don't really know how you can come back from that. But that's the magic of TV. We'll we'll we'll see.

104:11KT: I have a lot of faith in Courtney from watching a lot of interviews and also Power Confidential, which is like an after show that is hosted by Terrence J. I have a lot of faith in Courtney because it seems like well, it's not seems like. It is demonstrated through the series of Power that she she loves storytelling and she has a real talent for it. So she she talks about, you know, how you have those gotcha

104:39KT: sort of moments where, you know, it it was a twist that you never saw coming and she said that it was meticulously laid out. Everything that happened wasn't a surprise. Right? Because if you were there and you were paying attention, unlike Oti, there is more to dig beneath the surface. There is analysis to be had. But but it's it's it's not one of those shows where it's like, oh, this is here, and we never gave you a chance to be able to construct that together. Right?

105:08KT: So I have a lot of faith in the end of this series that it's going to make sense. She also talked about how in these last few episodes that the pacing is really going to ramp up, and we're going to focus on people that didn't really get as much focus and the aftermath of Ghost's death. So it's going to be quite interesting. I'm really interesting to see what's going to come out of that. Definitely follow Kolby and also us on the socials because we'll definitely keep you guys up to date

105:37KT: on what's going on with that. But is there anything else, Kolby or also Oti, that you wanna mention in regards to Power?

105:37Kolby: I don't know if I'm at a place where I'm I'm willing to rank it just yet because it's not over over.

105:37KT: That's why we don't rank yet because it's like it's a because once you say, like, once you say whatever that ranking is, it's like everything else you say is void. Right? It's like, well, you just stay with this number. Right?

106:03Kolby: Yeah. I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna wait. I'm gonna wait. But it is this is high value entertaining television. And I I love I love shows that connect

106:14Kolby: with mass audiences. I find them to be really fun, great for the conversation, great for the group chats. Let me tell you. My group chats are, like, fire when whenever it's, like, the weekend time. And everyone's like, yo. Did you see Power? Yo. This show happened, man. It is it it's great. Being a part of that conversation is always really, really fun. We don't get a lot of shows that do that. So I do appreciate,

106:32Kolby: this show for being like the Game of Thrones. I mean, if we had social media back when, like, Entourage and The Wire was on, like, we would have those same even more connecting points to them. But I'm really excited for January to come around. I'm gonna make time to follow weekly. You know? I don't know if we need to do, like, a weekly recap episode. I don't know.

106:53KT: Yeah. For Your Rotimis, you can you can do it. You can follow you can share with Oti. You guys can have your own poker. Oti, is there anything else you wanna mention about Power?

107:05Oti: I'm glad that it's getting all the plot it's that it is getting because it's such an amazing show. I feel like it's gone a bit underrated in the past few years because they've been delivering high quality entertainment week in week out. With well written female characters. Yeah. Well written strong female characters.

107:28KT: Nice. I'm not sure if that saved you from all of the garbage you were saying earlier. Don't laugh too soon, Kolby. I've got some I've got some for you as well. Let's let's dive into the segment we call For Your Reference. So if you've listened to our show before, this is literally where we recommend if you love Power or if you feel like Power, you know, could have been better, we recommend TV shows or also movies that you should watch after this or while you're waiting for it to come back. Kolby?

108:04Kolby: Yes. If you love Power, you will love Entourage. Entourage is like Power minus the hood, but it really has everything else. It's got characters that you're familiar with, like Benny, like Joseph Proctor. The story of four boys moving out to LA and living in the mean streets of Hollywood, dealing with a super agent, with an ego, with a super ego. You get all that same chemistry. If you're into tits, you'll get a lot of that. If you're into drugs, you'll get a lot of that. It is extremely

108:43Kolby: funny. It is sharply well written. Ari Gold is one of the most iconic characters in HBO's catalog. And if you like Power, you're gonna find a lot of what appeals to you in those elements of that story inside of Entourage. You know? Like, if you're looking for Ghost, then you're gonna get that within, within oh, damn. I forget his name. With inside the lead character. One of them names is Turtle. Yeah. Turtle. Well, Joe yeah. So, Joseph Proctor, Jerry Ferrara, that's Turtle. Like, that was

109:16Kolby: like, that oh, man. I love Turtle. You know, you you got Turtle. You got Ari. You got, you know, Kevin and everybody. So it's it's it's a really it's a really great show, and I think there's a lot. But if you like Power, you'll really, really dig Entourage. It's like Power, but funnier minus the hood. One other frame of reference I will I'll give I'll give to The Wire. We don't have a lot of shows. I know. I I haven't watched it. But from listening to this podcast,

109:44Kolby: I'm finding so many parallels to the way that the story is told and seeing the different perspectives between law enforcement, between who are the good guys and the bad guys, and how blurred those lines can be, I find really appealing. So now because I watch Power, I want to watch Wire that much more.

109:44KT: I think Kolby's just trying to become a regular on our podcast. Is that what's happening?

109:44Kolby: I'll I'll take it.

110:12KT: Well, The Wire is also very good. So I'm just going to add on to that before giving our reference. Another sort of similarity that Power has with The Wire is the creators of the show not only have the context and the reason for creating the story, but they also have their chops in writing as well. Because, you know, for for some people, it's enough just to watch something. And, yeah, the writing's not great, but, you know, you'll continue along with it. Right? But, you know, I'm the sort of consumer where I want to have,

110:52KT: you know, good writing. I wanna see payoffs. I wanna see full character development. That's what splooshes all my all my mountains. Right? That's exactly what we need to have. So thank you for referencing The Wire. It makes me wanna watch Entourage out of solidarity to you, Kolby, as well. We will reference Snowfall, which is an FX show that is currently just finished up its third season. It's got Damson Idris in it. We've also referenced it a couple of times as well. It's based in the nineteen eighties in California during the crack cocaine

111:29KT: era or even, like, you know, the genesis of it as well. And like I mentioned before, Damson Idris is definitely someone to watch. I fucking love him forever and always. And that show also has, you know, characters bolstered up in full development that you start to see. And it's one of those shows, again, that we're watching on a week to week basis that really captivates us in every single way.

111:57Kolby: How many seasons in is that?

111:57KT: Three.

112:00Kolby: Three? I think we give that a shot.

112:00KT: I would be remiss if I didn't mention also to reference Top Boy. This has recently been scooped up by Drizzy Drake and also Netflix, so it's quite accessible to watch along the theme of drug dealers as well, but they're based in Britain. And we'll definitely cover it on the show one of these days as well. So Top Boy. Oh, look at us. Well, hopefully, listeners, you've all learned something from this experience,

112:29KT: and we can all be better from it because we are not ghosts, and we will rise above all of the of the trash that we have. But, you know, if you enjoy this, we enjoyed it as well. And it's always good when you can have double pleasure going both ways. That is the best way to be your partner. Right, Oti? Mhmm. We're a well oiled machine around here. So let's start to finish it off. Kolby, between your delicious Kolby Told Me podcast and also the minority

113:09KT: report that you have, where can we find you in between podcasts?

113:12Kolby: Yeah. You can find your boy. I'm on all the socials at Kolby Told Me on Twitter and Instagram. And if you still got a Facebook, you could find me there too. I'm at Kolby Mac on Facebook. I mainly watch well, I watch a lot of I watch a lot of stuff. But I'm at the movies four to five times a week, trying to do reviews as much as I can. You could check my written content at KolbyToldMe.com. Shoot me an email if you're into that sort of thing. KolbyMac@KolbyToldMe.com. And,

113:40Kolby: man, you guys are just out of this world. Thank you for having me. It's been fun. I'm a super big fan, super duper duper big fan. And, my first year doing this would not have been what it is without you guys in my life. So thank you.

113:40KT: Aw. When when did you start?

113:40Kolby: Thanksgiving of last year is when I really said I'm gonna be a movie critic.

114:02KT: Cute. That that year. Was Yeah. We started in February around Oscar's time.

114:04Kolby: You guys. Yeah. It it's I'm trying I'm trying to remember, like, what the first I always try to think, man, when did I first catch y'all? Like and I I do not know, but I've been so much better for it. You guys are freaking awesome.

114:21KT: Oh, well, thanks so much. If you if you've just heard Kolby from our episode today, we strongly encourage you to check out his podcast. Like we've like we've discussed through the show, aside from the female characters, because apparently, these guys have a problem with it. Kolby is very balanced in his reviews, and he also isn't

114:44KT: pretentious about shit. Like, he will watch things, and he will enjoy things because he enjoys them, not because it's not the popular thing to have out in the critic sort of world. So definitely make sure you check out Kolby's podcast. If you wanna come and fight me in our Twitter mentions, you are most welcome. I love a good wrestle. I love a good fight. On Twitter and Instagram, we are for your ref pod if you wanna send us an email. hello@fyrpodcast.com. And on Apple Podcasts, we are also on there.

115:15KT: Please make sure if you love us enough, if you are team Ghost, please make sure you leave us a Apple rating and review for the sake of Kolby and Oti. If you know where all of the real characters are at and you're team Tommy and everyone else, also leave us a rating and review on Apple Podcast. But thank you so much, guys, for listening. Hopefully, you enjoyed this, and we'll see you guys next week. See you. Bye.