Ichi the Killer – Kakihara’s Labyrinth

Full transcript of Ichi the Killer – Kakihara’s Labyrinth.

0:00KT: It's another week in the For Your Reference household, and it is another course of our 2023 Reference Degustation

0:07Oti: Mm-hmm.

0:08KT: a monthlong celebration of the finest Takashi Miike Madness. Yeah, thi this is Friends and Lovers, the third of four courses, and you know, after we've had the most brilliant ingenuity, innovative meal we will ever devour in our sad little lives, now comes a course that is very underwhelming.

0:32Oti: Oh, straight to it.

0:34KT: Straight to it. Um, but what I will also do is usually the sommelier will come along and, and gesture to you the pairing of the wines. So I'm actually going to interrupt how I might be feeling about Ichi the Killer to do a Quid Pro Mo.

0:50Oti: who breaking genre tropes like tahi. And it can,

0:55KT: it can only be done record breaking, award-winning shout outs to Christine and all of the team at the Private Affairs podcast.

1:06Oti: Nice.

1:07KT: we first became aware, um, from the wins at the Australian Podcast Awards. So love and Splooshies. Congratulations. Um, it's currently dropped two out of five of its second season, Oti. And you know, perhaps in another multiverse you can do an audio drama about being a black man in Australia.

1:27Oti: Australia. The worlds not ready.

1:30KT: Friends and lovers, we will put it in the show notes. We talk about how art is so important to support, but also when it's great and it's steeped in quality, it should also be supported. So love and Splooshies to Christine and everyone at the team. This new season of Private Affairs kicks off with an unforgettable

1:49KT: birthday trip to Thailand. The character's journey through a story touching on work, mental health, reproductive choice and betrayal. Relationships will be tested and emotions will run high as this season leaned into drama. And also, Oti. They're not afraid to show that they can be divided against black people.

2:08Oti: Oh,

2:10KT: so you've got some work cut out for you. Oti. Clearly back to the course. Eat up friends and lovers friends and come plant lovers. Welcome I personally enjoy the come squats, but . Wow. You unraveled before we even got to the intro.

2:43Oti: Mm-hmm.

2:44KT: Welcome back to the For Your Reference podcast. We're feeling just as splush in our four years friends and lovers. You got your host KT

2:51Oti: and Oti

2:53KT: smirk into frame of overridden histories, kitty sniffers and love punches

2:59Oti: Ooh,

3:00KT: Enter Kakihara's Labyrinth with Ichi the Killer. This.

3:04Oti: Nice.

3:05KT: Yay. Or should I say Did you need subtitles, Oti? I did. Spoiler. Spoiler. Spoiler. Come. Squats. Come squats. Come squats. Friends and lovers. We're just going to get straight into it. This is our Takashi Miike run. And you know what I've also noticed? , we haven't ranked the films like we did, um, in Tarantino. So once I do the general stats information, before we do our first impressions, I see you cringing.

3:39KT: I know. Um, we will do that for all of the satiated friends and lovers on the Bean flicking couch. Takashi Miike directing in regards to writing the screenplay was by Sakichi Sato. And in regards to the manga, which makes so much sense that this was a manga by Hideo Yamamoto. In regards to release date. Again, this is right next to Visitor Q. We have another 2001 baby.

4:05KT: yeah, months and months apart. The Toronto International Film Festival, apparently this was like a little gimmick that they gave out, like vomit bags, . Like before the screening of this film, I would've given yawn bags, but that's just me.

4:19Oti: Oh. Feeling Salty

4:22KT: Yawns and the Johns In regards to actors, we have Tadanobu, Nao Omori, as well as Shinya Tsukamoto. How nice are rankings? Nice.

4:35Oti: Yeah.

4:37KT: Okay, well this is where we can meaningfully rank to be fair, because we only had done two previously. Friends and lovers, welcome, welcome, welcome. Um, if this is very new and you're super nasty and you're super late to the reservation in the For Your Reference, Reference Degustation, we are at our third course.

4:55KT: We are at our fourth Reference Degustation. Hayao Miyazaki was our. Um, the scarlet Pig of it all. We also did Tawa, uh, Quentin Jerome Tarantino, and now Takashi. So let's do a ranking. We don't need to rate them out of 10, but let's do a ranking. I think we're go, we're going to agree. It's going to be a very quick ranking.

5:20Oti: Yeah, it is. For me personally, it has to be Visitor Q, Audition, and then Ichi the Killer. Yeah. So far.

5:26KT: And there's a big gap between Audition and Ichi the Killer. But, you know, I, I keep getting carried away. Um, let's just get into general first impressions, shout outs to the patrons that were very bold to join us on this Miike Madness journey that have also contributed to common and recurring themes. But before we get to that first impressions, my love,

5:47Oti: I was most excited to watch this movie. Oh, the whole bunch that it's selected.

5:51KT: now. You wish we had JoJo's Bizarre Adventure, don't you?

5:56Oti: I just expected so much more from it, from everything that I'd read about it, um, even from just the general buzz on the internet for it. But sadly, man, I just, it, it didn't resonate with me that well. I really struggled through it. I could see what he was trying to do with the movie, but resonance and understanding just was so far.

6:18KT: I think the way I encapsulate it is the sensationalism that we come to know Miike for wasn't grounded in substance that we also can know him for.

6:29Oti: Mm-hmm.

6:30KT: A lot of the elements, a lot of, not necessarily the absurdity, but the notes of, I guess, taking things to the highest sort of octane weren't to purpose, so the impact was lost.

6:44Oti: you. I.

6:46KT: Um, I, I did tell you that I felt like this was based on some sort of like anime or manga just because of the way that the characters were set up. Um, I don't necessarily like the, I guess the overarching sort of story wasn't very interesting, and we also said spoilers. This is why we're calling it Kakihara's Labyrinth, because we thought he was Ichi. The.

7:09Oti: Yeah.

7:10KT: Visually, but even then, so I, I don't know, you don't need to answer it now, but like, I don't know how often, and I don't know how effective it is when you put the non titular character as a part of the whole marketing campaign ,

7:25Oti: but to

7:26KT: that to me that doesn't work. And also at the same time, it, he's visually very interesting to look. Right. And maybe that was the point because Ichi is very plain looking, right? Mm-hmm. , um, so to, to not have Ichi be Ichi on the poster. And also, uh, what is it, like two thirds? I wouldn't say it was three quarters, maybe it was two thirds of the film. We didn't even know who Ichi was. What do you look like?

7:52KT: So even then, because we didn't know who this character was, we didn't know what his motivations were. We didn't even know what per yes, I guess you could argue that there was world building in this film there, there was definitely no character building. And then you can't get any sort of emotional sort of resonance, far be it from me to feel for the family and Visitor Q. like like you. You gave me the notes of possibility and you snatched it away for nonsense.

8:21Oti: Mm. A lot of the elements about this movie just didn't work for me. Yeah. You know, um, I'm a very emotional watcher, so I try to grab a character that I'll fully be in with and I couldn't find it. You know, Kakihara was so interesting, but we really got barely anything from him. Yeah.

8:37KT: Yeah. He was battered though. He's like, oh, I dishonored you and, and everyone else. Okay. I'll cut

8:42Oti: Here's my tongue. Like I wanted, I wanted, if, if, you know, take Ichi out of the picture. Focus on and let's deep dive. for it. Let's go for it, man. Like

8:56KT: Like but full boss to the wall.

8:57Oti: Let's

8:58KT: get the mega Unrated version.

9:00Oti: And in as much as you know, the aspects of, I don't even know the quirks, are they quirks? The aspects about Ichi's character that are

9:08KT: you mean coming onto a plant? Is that a quirk to you? where

9:13Oti: If you want academia, you'd know it's a quirk.

9:16KT: Where were you In the Me Too movement. Oti.

9:19Oti: I'm behind Harvey Weinstein

9:23KT: And you know why? That's funny. Friends and lovers, because Tara is great. Apparently. That's why it's funny.

9:30Oti: Um, anyway, it's, I, I, I just expected so much more, especially we had our, our keen to know the backstory of Kakihara more. I wanted to know how and why. Yeah. And Ichi wasn't even that interesting. No, but Ichi's character. Also benign, I think, and really brought nothing to the table. I remember the head to head that I was anticipating between Ichi and Kakihara didn't even live up to the hype for me. Yeah. At least the hype in my head

9:56KT: we talk about the greatest battles of all time. You know, Goku and Ji, Sub-Zero and Scorpion, Naruto and Sasuke. Like we, we think about the greatest battles of all time and this did not build to anything.

10:12KT: Visitor Q. Using the rock to hit the dad over the head was more of a battle than what we saw in this film. And I guess Visitor Q is always going to be our ex that we compare everyone else to now. Like there's no way, like how does this film, I don't know. Cuz we talked about Visitor Q potentially feeling gritty and I guess, um, unfiltered that it felt like it came before.

10:36KT: Cinema, I guess more cinema friendly Audition. I don't understand Ichi the Killer came after this, but then maybe that's to talk to the adapting sort of ability as opposed to just being able to make a film. Mm-hmm. . So I guess one of the other things that I wanted to say about Ichi the Killer is it was boring.

10:57KT: Like for all of the fanfare, for all of the visuals, because you can't take anything away from the visuals of this film. Right. I think, I think the tenter hooks I'll need to let Mel, Mel Gibson know that he's got a new technique. Um, ready to go. Are you ready for Passion of the Christ?

11:14Oti: born. Ready?

11:18KT: Were you reborn? Ready?

11:19Oti: Uh, lots of other different

11:22KT: Um, but there's so much about this film that just didn't work and, you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't be as dramatic to say that it almost ended our podcast, but we also took a break recording the podcast cause it was like, What, what

11:37Oti: I did Life , this movie.

11:40KT: but I don't know, maybe, maybe it's also like, um, a reflection of the year that we've had in podcasting as well. Like sometimes it's just like a what the fuck man? Like. Why, why are we, and what are we doing? Um, but let, let, I guess let's get into the general themes, um, that we have common and recurring themes across the Miike sort of catalog that we are doing. Um, we kind of already talked about the cinematography. Is there anything else you wanna say about the visuals or even the score slash soundtrack?

12:11Oti: No, not really. I think everything else just took a backseat to what was unfolding in terms of, uh, the storyline, at least for me.

12:19KT: Okay, that's fine. Um, the next theme that we have, which I'm glad it's finding relevance while we continue to explore these films, is a commentary on Japan slash the world. Um, you know, we, I I will put a little bit of a trigger warning here, just that, you know, it, we, we talk about, you know, violence, especially in regards to women sexual as well as physical violence.

12:42KT: Um, I don't know cause, cause I. Themes can be explored, and I believe art is the vessel to be able to have these hard sort of conversations. I really feel like Visitor Q does that. It offers the vessel to be able to talk about uncomfortable themes, even to the fact of physical violence or even sexual violence against women, right?

13:04KT: For me, that was very effecti. . Right. Even though I wouldn't go so far as to say, some people claim that Audition was a feminist movie. Mm-hmm. because they haven't watched Ichi the Killer to know otherwise. But the way that, you know, women were portrayed or, you know, the way other characters, you know, um, interacted with the women in Ichi the Killer. It again, it had the same ingredients, but it just wasn't like, it wasn't baked the same.

13:31Oti: Yeah. I don't, man, I, I, I didn't get any, some, anything specific that felt to me that was, Hey, Japan, to the world sort of moment, there's sort of overarching themes that we've covered throughout the first two that we've watched, you know, and we could depict specific examples. Yeah. With this, I didn't get that aspect that.

13:51KT: Um, I've got one. Uh, it was when they were in the club and, you know, there was a lot of, they did use the word Yakuza, did they not?

13:59Oti: they? Mm-hmm. .

14:00KT: Um, there was a lot of ex-gang members that were kicked out, whether disgraced or otherwise. For whatever reason, they're not a part of the gangs anymore or the syndicates. I think at least in the subtitles they were saying. Um, and they were short talking about Shinjuku, um, how murder. And smuggling and rape is normal here. And if you have skills like that, you're only going to be able to get work in Shinjuku.

14:25Oti: Mm-hmm.

14:27KT: I think you're right though. I, because I think in a lot of senses I try not to. Overly where I feel where it isn't right. And I feel like even by me continuing this sentence is over-applying because I didn't necessarily feel like it was present in the film. Um, but I guess you could say on a broader sort of scale, this could be commentary on. You know, these sorts of seedy areas that people don't talk about,

14:55Oti: right? Mm-hmm.

14:56KT: Everyone has that pristine, shiny, um, you know, in some cases we talked about in Visitor Q that emasculation, um, of what people view Japan as. Right.

15:07KT: And that's not even, I'm not even talking about like the tourist postcard sort of sense. I'm just saying I don't even know if it's sort of ignorance. I think it's just like the general sort of, oh, this is how Japanese people are. They're so great. They're so lovely. That's not to say that they're not, but it's also, there are parts of society that aren't necessarily that way and perhaps could be addressed.

15:26KT: But again, I think I'm, I'm cleanly defining it more than it was in the film, but I would say it was there for there being sake.

15:35Oti: sent. Mm-hmm.

15:36KT: So this is something that I want to come to, to you because, you know, even when we talked about the commentary, like for us it was very easy to identify in Audition and Visitor Q that we were set in Japan. Um, what did, did you feel like any of this film was real or not?

15:50Oti: it felt real? It didn't feel, it didn't feel that we were getting a version of, let's say, Kakihara or anything like that. That wasn't necessarily reality. Everything felt sort of grounded in its masochistic sort of way. Yeah. And yeah.

16:07KT: Okay. I think the better question, considering we both didn't necessarily care for this film, was whether it was real or not, would that have made a difference to you?

16:18Oti: Oh, I don't think it would've.

16:20KT: Yeah. Right.

16:21Oti: I don't think it would've, if it would've felt more gimmicky than anything else. Mm-hmm. If I'm honest, it would be like, uh, time is non-linear moment. Yeah. For me.

16:30KT: Yeah, and I, I don't know where, I don't know where else this will fit in the themes, and I definitely want to talk about it for a little bit. Let's talk about Ichi because friends and lovers, I have never watched Inception and I don't think I have enough time to go and check it out in my own.

16:47KT: Leisurely time. I'm just going to pretend that what Jiji did to Ichi was inception. So let's kind of, let's spend some time picking that apart, because again, this is the worst, like I wouldn't say the worst. Sorry. This is, um, the sort of storytelling that is the least engaging for me and it's the hardest for me to latch onto.

17:12KT: In that two-thirds of the film, we waited to actually meaningfully get to know who Ichi was, and even as we got to know Ichi, he had this really, um, confronting kink of, I've, I've, I've written it down actually. Um, I think she also said it as well, your, your, you only like women that are black. . Right. So it's, it's, see it's not just, um, you know, women that have been, you know, physically abused, but it's also seeing the act happen that's part of his kink.

17:45KT: Right. And you know, we're not here to kink-shame, and you can do it in very safe ways. Okay. Armie, Oti, Hammer. Like there are safe ways to explore kinks and when definitely not kink-shaming. Um, so there's that Ichi that we came to know later on in the film after we see the super cute visuals of Kakihara. That was an Ichi, right?

18:08KT: So we get to know this is who Ichi is, and then we get a plot twist that that was never who he was. He never really killed his parents. Right. So this kink was, I guess, indoctrinated into him from Jiji. Um, and also the fact that, so he did kill his parents, but then that was like, I think added on top. I think he actually did, and that is real in proverbial air quotes.

18:33KT: Um, but all of this sort of sensationalism that Ichi had all of that sort of driving sort of motivators and him saying, really, Gross stuff about, you know, what gets him off. Right? Like, you know, it's fucked up when even I say it's uncomfortable, right?

18:49Oti: Yeah, it is. I think when we talk about the two, sort of the strongest characters in the movie in Ichi and Kakihara, both of them don't really have control over their own lives. Yeah. You know, um, we are, they're all controlled by, in this for Ichi, his interest is Jiji. Kakihara has his own mob boss and who, who had disappeared. But you know, there's still people above him.

19:12KT: was, what was that weird line about trying to say he's gay? What was that? That was weird.

19:17Oti: Yeah.

19:17KT: like, if you're gonna go there, go there. Or does he just love his boss and he doesn't wanna see him get hurt? That's a pretty normal, non-gendered, non sexuality feeling.

19:25Oti: Yeah. People can't be proud of their work, you know? He, he's there to protect his boss. . Yeah. Yeah. Weird. I think that was the sort of, if there's anything that I took out of this movie is that most of us are controlled in our. And we are all in our own Truman Show.

19:43KT: I don't think we've done Jim Carrey on this podcast.

19:45Oti: Yeah, we've got to cover that. Um, ESP Turk,

19:52KT: I don't know. I, I don't know about that. But, um, friends and lovers, we've also been playing a game called, is it called Stanley's Parable?

19:59Oti: Yeah.

20:00KT: Um, that's very interesting. Look it up in your spare time, friends and lovers, but you know, to talk about that banal sort of ity um, of life and that sort of thing. And also, it wasn't to the point where the film made me angry because the only, I think. The only times I get angry in a film is when I get, um, Tyra Banks disappointed. You know, like where I felt like it could have been something and it failed to deliver because I didn't care about this film. Maybe that's why I wasn't angry.

20:28KT: But the final showdown was a bit of, was a whole lot of nonsense. Even the fact that like Kakihara might. Still be alive. And then they had like that, um, that scene, uh, little, little trigger, um, warning friends and lovers of like someone hanging on a tree. I couldn't guess who that was. And then there was also like closing up, like zooming in on some young kid as if that's to suggest like a sequel or you know, some sort of Easter egg breadcrumb or whatever it is.

20:58KT: Like at that point I just didn't fucking care. I'm just roll the fucking credits.

21:02Oti: I hear you. I think one of the most funniest things that happened in the movie was Jiji's reveal. I cackled hard, man. It was.

21:17KT: wild, stupid. But you know, we, we get our, we get our resonance or we get our giggle gaggles wherever we can, friends and lovers. Let's continue to direction slash stylistic choices. This from Rob, unflinching, graphic nature of the violence.

21:30Oti: Did you want violence in the movie? Who they, they had it in heat loads, I think, to the point where it was almost not even, almost, it was uncomfortable. Yeah. It felt very gratuitous in nature to the point where I didn't even understand if it had any meaning at that point. Yeah. Especially towards women. And it felt, I was like, okay, there's so many repeating moments of that that I was like, okay. What are, what are you trying to say? Because not just use your fucking words.

21:58Oti: it. Don't show us anymore. Yeah, just do like, women are like, I don't even understand this man. Yeah, it was super uncomfortable,

22:05KT: but like, you are right. Because if it was to prove a point, if it was to make a statement, you made it already. We like beating up women and it gets us off. Like we get it. Like how many times do you have to do it?

22:18Oti: And, and they'll be just there, you know, half naked or naked. Yeah. In their own blood.

22:24KT: but their nipples were cut off. So it doesn't count as nudity.

22:26Oti: Like, I just, I'm like, bro, yeah, at some point, the first, the second, the third. Now you're just taking this too far.

22:34KT: But I think you're right because I think, uh, gra like gratuitous, um, sort of sex or violence, people like using that. But this is ab absolutely, genuinely where it should be applied. Because For what? For what reason? Other to make us be like, okay, bet. Like we get it Like what? Like there's nothing else to learn. Yeah.

22:55Oti: Whatever messaging was already received, uh, and the continued usage of that just felt, I don't know, like the can,

23:03KT: But for someone that likes to eat all of the meat off the bones, including the cartilage, even for you it was done. There was nothing else to pick at.

23:10Oti: Yeah. Yeah. Couple. Now just move on from this

23:13KT: Yeah, I know.

23:13Oti: know. Tell us more about Ichi. Tell us more about Kakihara. Tell us anything else other than this.

23:18KT: Yeah. No, absolutely, absolutely agree. Um, this comes from Ben, the interaction between sex and violence. It's not healthy

23:26Oti: It is not because Ichi needs to go talk to someone. talk to Didi

23:38KT: I also have a note here saying, when is Ichi not hard?

23:42Oti: Yeah

23:43KT: man, there was some primo they should, um, hire to knock here because there was some primo bulge shots in, in Ichi the Killer.

23:51Oti: And why is he so angry every time? Like if you've got a boner, you don't need to do something about it every single time. the boner can just be,

23:59KT: Can we print that on some merch? Can you say that one more time?

24:05Oti: You can let the boner just be, you don't have to do something about it every single time.

24:09KT: But you also said 15 minutes ago you were behind what? Harvey Weinstein too.

24:13Oti: Yeah.

24:17KT: We don't need that on merch though.

24:18Oti: He got up and he was like fighting himself on the bed trying to, oh, why is he not great? Like, come on now. What? What is this

24:27KT: Just rub one out. You'll be fine.

24:29Oti: Oh, it was wild. It was wild. I think

24:33KT: Aren't you the king of post-nut clarity, though. You should know why he was so clouded.

24:37Oti: I, I guess so. I guess so. But I think with everything else happening in the movie that got lost, I think everyone needed a post-nut clarity moment, Uhhuh,

24:47KT: but not the women, right?

24:48Oti: They're too busy being black and blue.

24:49KT: Remember that was a Tyrese movie with Naomie Harris. Well, I guess there were films of the same caliber out there.

24:59Oti: See? See you adding culture to this, eh,

25:01KT: right? ? No. Don't make me sound like Jonah Hill in You People. When I say, when I say it wasn't Eddie Murphy's character that said say black culture, it's not the culture. say black culture.

25:15Oti: and apparent in the C, the whole kissing scene, which is wild man.

25:18KT: that. Stop that. We've got enough nonsense in this, uh, in this, um, film. I also have written down the most dramatic slap in history. Oh man. Yeah. This, this film is, is something else. And we didn't even get our pixelated porn in this film.

25:37Oti: Yeah, man. I think I would've taken some of that away from the brutality of Viro, right? Mm-hmm.

25:43KT: Um, let's get to the next one, Rob. Brutal justification to right the wrongs. I think, I think there is an inherent, um, component that doesn't apply to this film because what would be the right and the wrongs in this film?

25:59Oti: Yeah, weird because Kakihara did whatever he wanted because he is a masochist and sadist at the same

26:06KT: mm-hmm.

26:07Oti: Uh, Ichi, he did whatever he fucking wanted.

26:10KT: I, I'm just because we're doing it for a podcast, otherwise, I probably wouldn't think much more about this film or any of the lines in this film. But Jiji talks about how, you know, um, Ichi gets hard, but he can't ejaculate. And now I'm confused because is that something that Ichi always had or is that as a result of Jiji's inception?

26:34Oti: I think I bit of both, but he, he does ejaculate because we

26:38KT: no, I think we only saw him do it once and it was on that plant.

26:41Oti: But that doesn't, that means that he can't ejaculate the mere fact that he was only shown once. It means

26:47KT: no, but that's because he saw the act of whenever Jiji is doing that mind control thing, it's an imagination. So he, I guess he wasn't as creative in the man. So I guess in this instance, what are like, what would you say, because I don't think it was satisfactory. I think we can both agree, but can you tenuously piece together what the right what for the wrong.

27:11Oti: Mm, no, not really.

27:13KT: because I think, I think we agree the women were done wrong in this movie and that was never made right. I think Jiji was the winner. He was jacked, and Jiji got super jacked We were like a Master Roshi. Scene

27:25Oti: he's exactly Master Roshi,

27:27KT: but he got like super, super like outta nowhere. There's your Master Roshi index right there. Wild. Um, let's move on to Ben. So this is essentially, I guess, the core of this film. Unchecked desires and passions.

27:42Oti: um, everyone

27:43KT: Yeah.

27:45Oti: everyone acted on their desires and passions.

27:47KT: Now, could you be anymore unchecked?

27:51Oti: There's no limit. Like there's, there's no filter. Everyone did whatever it is they wanted without, uh, most of them without any sort of consequence. So, yeah. Yeah. It, it was mad.

28:03KT: Well, just like Oti said, you can waste a boner and sometimes restraint is a good thing if you're nest.

28:08Oti: thing. Mm-hmm.

28:09KT: a line that I thought was very interesting. It was one of the henchmen he was talking about, um, the civilian, like civilian sort of life and how that is the more of this, you know, being a slave to the clock and to the nine to five and I don't know, in, in amongst all of the madness, I kind of resonated with that sentiment. All right, let's finish off, uh, women in dominant positions. This is from Ben.

28:35Oti: I think anyone that came close to a dominant position was Kakihara's, um, sort of temporary girlfriend.

28:41KT: Yeah. But she, yeah, I guess she just, she wasn't about it.

28:46Oti: Yeah. , I guess everyone has a line. Yeah.

28:49KT: And they're all in submissive positions anyway. The women that were in this film.

28:53Oti: in mm-hmm. ,

28:54KT: man, we are really double spacing this shit, aren't we?

28:56Oti: shit. Yep.

28:59KT: Is there anything generally, um, that you want to say? My love,

29:02Oti: I just expected better. I think going in and having so many expectations of what, especially after Visitor Q my, my expectations are so high, and to be met with something that Yes. Still spoke to a generic sense of him is covering sort of the taboos of stuff. Yeah. Which we don't see quite that quite often.

29:23KT: Correct.

29:24Oti: Violence is something that's always in, is in movies most of the

29:27KT: of it. Yeah.

29:27Oti: And he took it to a different degree and I think they chose to linger on aspects of that violence and depict it in such a way. The brutality of it, I think was unsettling. . But to continually do it repeatedly, multiple times in the movie felt weird and to the point where it, it wasn't even about Ichi at all. You know the movie's called Ichi the Killer, but come on now. We could call this any anything else

29:57KT: Ichi the Kinker. Well, it was right there.

30:02Oti: It was, it was, but you know what, at the end of the day, I think we have one more, um, Takashi Miike movie to.

30:10KT: Ladies and gentlemen. Ichi the Kinker and the CU

30:13Oti: Mm-hmm. .

30:16KT: Um, yeah, I, yeah, interestingly, I don't think I had high expectations of this film. I think I just had a very beautiful mouthful of Visitor Q. So whatever comes next I was fine with. Um, would you say that, how does this pit against your worst Tarantino, which I think you said was Reservoir Dogs.

30:37Oti: Oh,

30:38KT: See there was a story in Reservoir Dogs and the dialogue was

30:41Oti: Yeah, I, I think this is at the bottom, man. , so

30:44KT: far, the bottom of all stations,

30:46Oti: the bottom of all

30:47KT: we haven't done a God ranking. And you're doing

30:50Oti: just, just saying I need the last one to pick it up, man. Save this Degustation for what?

31:00KT: what's the Jojo rabbit.

31:01Oti: Ugh. Yeah.

31:02KT: Wow. Okay, So I guess we're not sure about that First Love, um, is going to be very interesting as well. But thank you friends and lovers for joining us. Um, another week in the For Your Reference podcast. Usually we end with our For Your Reference segment, but right now this is a set menu, Audition, Visitor Q, Ichi the Killer, and First Love on the Way.

31:25Oti: Mm-hmm.

31:27KT: If you would like an instructional aerobic video of come squats, on Twitter and Instagram we're @ForYourRefPod,

31:33Oti: Write us an email, hello@fyrpodcast.com.

31:36KT: We're also on God Tier Rankings podcast if you'd like to leave a rating and review and we'll see you guys in the next course. See you. Bye.