Legally Blonde – Crash and Perm
Hosted by
KT & Oti
Show Notes
Welcome to a world of fantasy where people drink out of public water fountains, look like well endowed caricatures but your worth as a woman is based on getting married. Court is in session with Legally Blonde this week.
Referenced
Episode Details
- Duration
- 0:00
- Released
- July 13, 2021
- Category
- Episode
- Hosts
Transcript
Transcript (7,546 words)
Full transcript of Legally Blonde – Crash and Perm.
KT: It's another week in the year of our ever eternal Regina King. Welcome, welcome. This episode today was kind of trying to prove to myself that I can enjoy films that are light. And I'm pretty sure moving forward, we'll just cover sad, lonely, depressing shit. Let's get on with the show. Smooches, friends and lovers. Welcome back to the For Your Reference podcast. You got your host, KT. And Oti. Welcome to a world of fantasy where people drink out of public water fountains, look like well endowed caricatures,
KT: but your worth as a woman is based on getting married. Mhmm. Welcome, welcome friends and lovers. If this is the first time, and I hope to God not you're a super fan of this film, but if this is how you've come across our podcast, welcome, welcome, welcome. And for those of you that have pervade the For Your Reference podcast more than a couple of times, thank you. We love and appreciate you so much. Right on the top of this spoiler, spoiler, spoiler. And in every other case, skip it, skip it, skip it.
Oti: Can't even spoil a movie like this. I am big mad fan.
KT: Feeling my blood pressure rising, I tell you. Alright. Well, let's get into the stats so we can continue on with whatever this shit show is. The first film was released in October 2001. These are based on books that were created by Amanda Brown, director Robert Luketic, as well as another writer of Karen McCullah. In regards to the stars, we have Reese Witherspoon, Luke Wilson, as well as Selma Blair. The budget that we had for this film was $18,000,000 with a worldwide gross of a $141,700,000.
Oti: Woah.
KT: I suppose. Legally Blonde two, Red, White and Blonde came out two years later in 2003. We have director Charles Herman-Wurmfeld. Again, this is based on the characters of the books comprised from Amanda Brown and we have Eve Ahlert as credited as a writer. Stars, we have Reese Witherspoon, Sally Field, and Bob Newhart. In regards to the budget, we have $45,000,000, which seems to be, you know, kind of the trend once the first one makes quite a splash and becomes quite popular. The sequel, even though it probably isn't as great quality wise,
KT: does get a bigger budget. Worldwide gross of a $124,900,000. Wow. So not far off from the the first earnings, but I'm sure they were expecting a lot more than what they got out of that. Yeah. I was expecting to get something out of this, but here we are, grumpy KT in full effect. Let's start off with Oti. First impressions because this the onus, the the the burden of of proof, sir, lays with you because you've actually watched this before. So you knowingly walked into this. So
KT: give us your first impressions, how you felt watching it for the first time and also
Oti: now. So I watched the first Legally Blonde back. I think it was a school event. Okay. And it was fine, like a Saturday night movie and it was just cool. I didn't think too much of it. It was fine for the time. I had a couple of giggles here and there. And then when I rewatched it yesterday, it was still fine. Like, don't get me wrong. We know what you get when you know what to expect when you're getting to
Oti: to watch a movie like this. You know? You're not going to get any Oscar worthy sort of performances. The story is gonna be quite shallow because it's a lot of hard end movie fun. You know? And sometimes you need that sort of movie because not every time you need your brain overthinking things or how bloody you shoot a bullet in reverse. But I think the mistake we made was saying because we've watched the first one, let's do the sequel as well. Yeah.
KT: We should have stopped at the first. And even getting ready to record this, Like you mentioned, we saw that there was a second one, but while we're getting ready to record this, we realized that there was a 2009 film and they're relatives of Elle Woods and they come from England and go to California or the other way around. And there's also an upcoming 2022 film. But rest assured, friends and lovers, this is the Boyz II Men End of the Road for us in regards to the Legally Blonde lore.
KT: Well because I think the first one was fine. And we'll talk about both of the films, but I agree. We should have just stopped there and not but also our ever eternal in the year and a decade and eternity of Regina King. That's why we watched the second one. If we didn't see Regina King was credited, we probably just stayed with the first one.
Oti: Yeah. And I was just gonna say that because I didn't I had no idea that there was a second Legally Blonde
Oti: that passed me by. And that was my first Today was my first time watching it. So it was quite something to behold.
KT: See, Oti talks about corrupt politicians,
KT: but what he's doing right now, if you can hear very sabotele, is he's cleaning his hands off of this.
Oti: Oh, man. You know,
Oti: being a Pontius Pilate here, you know, washing my hands off this.
KT: Passion of the Christ, go and listen to that episode. It is very
Oti: And
Oti: it's one of those things where there was a bar set with the first one. Those expectations and we knew what we were going to get. Yeah. But for them to somehow go way below that bar from my expectations,
Oti: it was mind blowing. It was mind numbing.
KT: Oh, yeah. Absolutely. And there's also, you know, there's a reason why once Cinderella and her man, you know, fuck off in that pumpkin, you don't see what happens afterwards because domesticated life is boring. Life is a whole lifelong boring slideshow.
KT: Mhmm. Right? And and after the first film, there was really nothing else that we needed to see. It was just her living life. There was a point to the first film and there wasn't to the second. So we were really just meandering till we got to the end. Yeah. Because now you have to nitpick
Oti: exciting aspects of the mundanity of fucking life.
Oti: And
KT: That's what podcasts are for, friends and lovers.
Oti: And they had to cherry pick Elle's crusade for saving animals from
Oti: being cosmetically tested on.
KT: Yeah. And yeah, we'll definitely go into each of the films, but I a 100% agree with you. And what you were saying in your first impressions, I definitely agree with because, you know, much like I said with anything to do with surrounding, you know, superhero films, be a Marvel, a DC, like, I know those films aren't gonna be for me. You know, the fan service isn't necessarily in my direction, and I accept that. So anything that I enjoy is a bonus. So I I came in prepared
KT: to accept that potentially I'm not going to enjoy the film to the heights of, I guess, the targeted audience is going to have. So anything that I enjoyed out of Legally Blonde was going to be a bonus. So it wasn't as if I was expecting, like you said, for it to be part of my Criterion Collection, if you're welcome. Right? So maybe we're not welcome. But I really enjoyed it. I I really enjoyed how self contained the first film was, but it really undid itself in the second film.
KT: And, you know, even if you guys wanna email us or tweet at us and tell us that, you know, the lore gets better and it's more richer in the third iteration, the third offering. I cannot. I cannot to continue to go down this path. Just let me cry on the floor with all of the sad films I love because I'm not doing this again. I'm absolutely not watching this film again.
Oti: And no one would bloody no one would blame you. No one would blame me for that. It's a decision where I think I need to do a thesis. You know what I need to do a thesis on? On sequels that get a higher budget and they reproduce such abominations. There has to be a correlation. Give them less money, then rack their brains to see how much they can get the next one. I tell you. Wow. There's something in there. Yeah.
KT: I suppose. So so let's focus specifically on the first movie because at least there are moments that we enjoyed in the first one. And then maybe in the second, we can just talk about Regina King for the rest of the episode. The first film I really enjoyed. I really enjoyed the soundtrack. The soundtrack made me feel like anything was possible and I didn't have a care in the world. But that's not how I was brought up. But listening to the music,
KT: I was like, yes, let me strut down the street and try and go and make some change. It was a bubblegum movie, it had a bubblegum soundtrack and I was absolutely fine with it. Because I knew that's the sort of film that we were getting into. And I think in the sort of dynamics that they were hoping to lay out in the film, it did work, albeit very stretched. So the fact that they tried to extend that to another film, obviously, as we said, didn't work at all.
KT: But yeah, the the soundtrack really helped build that light fluffy world where you can really achieve anything and no one's gonna stand in your way.
Oti: Yeah. Because once you set your mind to it, everything's possible.
KT: Oh, absolutely. And actually, while we're getting to that, one of the key sort of, you know, turnaround moments that we have in Legally Blonde is when she's going to look for a dress and they're in a boutique store.
KT: And the sales assistant says something to the effect of, there's nothing I love more than a dumb blonde with daddy's plastic. And that's where we're like, plot twist, she's smart.
Oti: Yep. Yep. You could you could see being set up. It's the whole premise. It's the script flip. She's actually smart.
KT: Yeah. Who'd have thought? So that's fine. Like if that's as deep as we delve into this, then that's absolutely fine. And that's what the movie was offering. And I was expecting that that's probably the biggest crescendo that we would have gotten in the film. So that's fine. You know, I'll I'll wank myself over something else. It obviously won't be in this movie, but I was okay with where we were
KT: being taken.
Oti: Yeah. We see her exhibit her smartness throughout the movie, her intelligence quite shows and I think one of the strengths is her being undermined because I think people just now sit back waiting for her to implode, which doesn't happen. And she goes from strength to strength. She even pushes herself farther. So not only is she relying on a sort of intellectual smarts, she also trying to dig deep and research and read and do, you know, just to push herself to go farther and beyond,
Oti: which, you know, when I was watching as a kid, I was like, oh man, I need to be a go getter like that. So it's sort of set up a message. And yeah, I'm just, it's weird when you watch this sort of evolve for the movie and also come to the sort of crescendo sort of ending where she's in the courtroom. I'm sure we'll get to that later, which I think was really, really well set up.
KT: You know, there's
KT: gourmet, you know, $20 burgers, and then there's the dollar menu. You know, they all have different times and moments in our life's tapestry. And this film is no different to the latter. Right? But I would say actually, another positive of Legally Blonde was, first of all, the runtime, ninety minutes, cute, sweet, love it, bring some more of that. But secondly, the pacing was very good. The pacing was very good in the first movie. A lot happened and we were moving along with Elle's, you know, sort of coming into her own. You know, we
KT: talk a lot about getting invested and me specifically, Hughie from The Boys specifically, I get frustrated when we as an audience are bought into the world or at least understand the world in Legally Blonde's case. And we're just waiting for the main sort of protagonist to get with us so we can go where we need to go. Right? There were moments that frustrated me in regards to Elle, but then at the same time, you know, as flawed as her ex was,
KT: she did genuinely love him. So her umming and ahhing and going back and forth was believable. But I did like that it didn't take too long for her to realize that, which is summarized in, you know, a piercing quote that maybe even your auntie would use on Facebook. I'm never gonna be good enough for you, am I? Yeah. There's some truth bombs in there.
Oti: I think it was so
Oti: it was sort of sad seeing how she chased this man that she clearly loves, like you said. And him only having that sort of eye towards where he wants to be and who his ideal partner is. If I'm gonna be a senator by 30, I need a Jackie, not a Marilyn. Yeah. And I reckon okay. In as much as he's a dick, think that's sort of been drilled down from his family. Well, if you wanna keep your hand in daddy's pockets, you got to oblige. Yeah. And I think fair enough. He's a man. He should make his own decisions. I get that. But there's also this side of he's probably been told that since he was a kid. He's been brought up that way. He's been brought up, you know, you have fun now, but when it comes to marrying, you need to marry someone who would take you to that stage. And that person is fits this criteria and has to tick all these boxes.
KT: It's interesting. It's interesting how writing can, you know, transform and elicit the mood of the film. Because when he broke up with her and said, I need a Jackie, not a Marilyn, that could have easily turned into Promising Young Woman. Like Elle is very cute and she's very determined, but with a different lens that could have been vindictive following him to Harvard. Right?
Oti: It could have been. It really could. You know, I was envisioning, you know, the first time I watched this should go there and just stop being a stalker, you know, turn into an Omar Epps, something like that.
KT: A Fatal Affair.
Oti: And see how that all sort of unfolds. And I think there's a story in there where if they wanna do a Legally Blonde three, mate, change the storyline.
KT: Well, I think three already exists, but in any case Ugh. Yeah. It is interesting you bring that up, but it's true. Everyone
KT: has a choice and everyone is an adult, even if your hand is still in daddy's pocket, which is an Oti and I role play for another day. You're right. You're absolutely right because he didn't have to be with her. It was kind of her choice to go to Harvard. Right? It was her choice to go there and far be it for me to use the incel word in Elle Woods' direction.
KT: But it was kind of like, you just need to accept the fact that he broke up with you. Right? It's not like he skipped town and never told you. He was honest and upfront about you. Right? And even though it hurt, at least he at least he was upfront about it, I guess is the point.
Oti: Oh, agreed. A 100% agreed. I think it was it was creepy if you think about
KT: But it a she's she's like a she's a cutesy petite blonde. So I guess it doesn't come off as creepy.
Oti: Yeah. But her going there and also you know it sort of showed that she had this determination and I think until she found out her self worth and that self love is really key. Yeah. I think
KT: In her speech, she said that in her speech. Very nice.
Oti: Yeah. And I think once she discovered that because the whole movie is a journey for her self discovery and it had to be that way so that she realizes that outside of the glamorous of glam of, oh, I'm gonna get married and engaged
Oti: to this guy or whatever, not in that particular order, then that's her last set of March. But we know a life throws you curveballs. So once Warner broke up with her, it was just one of those things that spun in the system, in the works that just she couldn't compute. And she had to sort of cling to this ideology. But little did she know that her journey going there and doing all those things transformed into someone else.
KT: Yeah, but then it completely undid itself right at the end. They reminded me of Coming to America,
KT: the original film where it's like she's a strong woman and then it just falls back into traditional ideals that your worth is measured to the man on your side.
KT: Right?
Oti: Yeah. See that.
KT: Like, is it too much to ask to have Elle go to law school for herself and not to get her ex back?
Oti: Despite the reasoning, think the the how the movie or at least how it was written, it was it was a slow burn in her realizing
Oti: why what she needed to do that and what that meant for her. Know, it's not her reasoning for doing that in her head might have been wrong, but once she started doing the work, everything came into place. She realized that she enjoyed it more. She was capable of doing all that. She was way better than all the other people there. And yeah, it was weird.
KT: Oh, and it was so condescending.
KT: It's like Harvard is Harvard. Right? And he's like, how did you get in here? I don't think you it's like, dude, she got in you dumbass.
Oti: There's this scandal about colleges and how kids got on there because they their parents paid the university a lot of money for whatever. Felicity and the Full House lady. Yeah. So you don't have to take it that, oh, you're in Harvard because you're smart. You could just be, you're in Harvard because your parents are rich.
KT: No. But in regards to like standing,
KT: it was made very clear that he was gonna be with someone that was from a prestigious family. So in that sense, Elle wouldn't have gotten that way, she would have gotten through her own merit. Let's let's speak about her I was gonna call it an audition tape. Let's talk about her video essay into the uni. I think, you know, taking a leaf out of Basic Instinct's book, she was aware of the panel, the demographic of the panel. Because we I talked about just accepting we're in this airy fairy sphere, not necessarily
KT: in reality or have real world consequences. I get that. But the dialogue was bothersome to me. A lot of the other moments I could just ignore, but when they were talking about admissions into Harvard, it just, it rubbed me the wrong way when they were trying to appease or appeal to her case saying, you know, she's got these interests, she brings all of this talent. One of the quotes said, aren't we always looking for diversity? Because saying things that you're aware of doesn't mean you're being held accountable,
KT: sir. Mhmm. Can I get a clean up on the For Your Reference aisle, you nasty fuckers? Wow. It just like it bothers me. Like, because you mhmm.
Oti: As Conway Stern would say, diversity double whammy.
KT: Oh, in comes my Conway Stern to save the day.
Oti: Yep.
KT: Thank you, Oti.
Oti: You're welcome.
KT: As much as we were disappointed in the later seasons of Archer, go and listen to that episode. You'll have a tremendously better time than we did watching this film. But, yeah, there were many moments in this film that I could just, you know, shake my head and be like, okay, fine. This is the film. Like, there was a lot of times she was talking about being blonde. I think it's in the second film she talks about being in the blonde minority.
KT: So that that like, I know that happens later, but there's a lot of that sort of dialogue that happens in the first film. And I know that we're supposed to treat it more like a Milo and Otis or just, you know, something that doesn't really translate to real life even though it has real life sort of aspects to it. But when they were succinctly talking about the institution of like higher learning, it just rubbed me the wrong way.
Oti: Yeah. I see your point. I see your point. It was like, when he said that, I was like,
KT: it was also like, when did Ally McBeal come out? Because I don't even understand the perception, even though I did laugh. You know, Elle's dad is like, why do you wanna be a lawyer? Those are for ugly and boring people.
Oti: Wasn't Ally McBeal in the nineties? Yeah. I think it was late nineties, but maybe Ally McBeal doesn't exist in this world of theirs. Yeah. But but like Suits exist,
KT: like, I I feel like there's a whole genre of attractive
KT: lawyer people.
Oti: There's a slew of them. There really is. And I think one of the things that
KT: If they're not fit, you must acquit.
Oti: Yeah. Wow. Yeah. It was weird sort of coming out with that sort of thinking where lawyers were supposed to be this ugly, non successful people. Whereas, you know, maybe that's the world for the rich people. Super, super rich. But Yeah.
KT: That's why I said fantasy.
Oti: Yeah. For us, you're like, oh, man. I wanna be a lawyer.
Oti: That's a that's a goals, mate.
KT: But I I like, you know, no matter how rich I ever get in my life, I will never drink from a public water fountain. That was such a casual scene. You probably didn't even notice it, but it still shocked me. Wow. Speaking of a world where everything is possible, I didn't like how casually ableist some of the writing in this first movie was. There was three specific, you know, hurtful words in regards to, you know, those of different abilities and I didn't care for it. And it's also unnecessary.
KT: Right? Like, we love our Australians. We at some point, there was a time that we did like Sia, but you know what I mean? Like, there's no reason to bring a community into your script, especially if it's just to speak badly or use it as an insult to someone. You know what I mean? And I'm not gonna specifically say what the words are, but if you've watched Legally Blonde if you watch Legally Blonde recently or even now, those words will definitely stick out like a sore thumb. Because it was unnecessary
KT: and uncalled for. And also, across both films, I didn't like the way they treated the queer community. I didn't like it. Like, if we're talking about the first film, there was a whole pool boy element. Right? And about the wife, you know, having a fatal attraction with the pool boy And the way that they, I guess, resolve that storyline
KT: and the way they outed him, I just I didn't care for that. It's like, isn't there another way you can write this without punching down to a community that aren't even part of it and you just put them in there to write these terrible things. Maybe it's not that deep, but also you didn't even need to put it in the script. So I will call it out.
Oti: I agree with you on
Oti: a lot of those things. I think one of the aspect to at least the reveal, I didn't take any offense. Maybe it's not mine to take, but like that was the whole crux of the case. Oh, you mean who's well, your boyfriend's name?
KT: Yeah. No. That's I mean more when she was asking
KT: her shoes that. And it's like, he's gay, he's gay, just based on that. Okay, cool dude, but like, come with some evidence, Cowabunga. Like, I just like, I didn't I didn't care for that. And it's also really low hanging fruit in regards to writing. You couldn't have you couldn't have phrased it in a better way. I guess not because it's a simplistic sort of film in every insult of the sense. But man, like like imagine just randomly,
KT: you know, bringing up Polynesian people just to punch down. You know what I mean? Like, I just didn't care for it is my point.
Oti: Yeah. Fair enough. Like, yeah,
Oti: I see that. One of the things that maybe that's just sort of the sign of the times and
Oti: the progress that sort of been made when watching this movie now that those things stick out. Because when I when I was younger and I was watching this, like, those things didn't stick out. I just wasn't aware of all those things. So maybe, you know, with my growth and everyone else's growth, then we see progress. And that's why they stick out when we're watching it now.
KT: Yeah. But I I would push back on that and say, how about a queer child watching this when they were as young as you were or those with different abilities that were as young as you were. Just sitting there and getting slapped in the face by a movie. It's not cool. It's not cool. It's not cool at all.
Oti: I agree.
KT: You can wear all the pretty pink things you want, but I still notice this shit.
KT: Actually, and this comes to a point near the end of the film where she's really down on herself and, you know, like she's getting really discouraged and she says something to the effect of, all they see is blonde hair and big boobs. Since it's being pointed out, she had a decent set, but that it kind of took me aback. No, it took me aback because she didn't say boobs. She said big boobs. Yeah.
Oti: She's she's not race wither boobs. Well, she's not Dolly Parton out here. That much is true. Yeah. But I agree with you. Like, she kept on referencing the big they kept on referencing the big boobs and all. So like, okay, cool. Maybe maybe 2003
Oti: big boobs.
KT: I don't know. I guess so. And we do love Jennifer Coolidge. I do feel bad that we're not giving enough love and accolades to Jennifer Coolidge. But she did have a mention talking about how, you know, she fell out of favor and her marriage was falling apart. And she was saying, I think all she had to prove for it was a fat ass. Which again, you said different sign of the times because everyone loves a fat ass.
Oti: A fat ass. Ass man right here.
KT: You, Oti. Revealing what you decide week by week, my love. Okay. I wanna know a bit more about Bend and Snap. Like, was it big in Kenya? In Australia, it was really big. And, you know, I was in high school at the time and it was all the girl it was what all the girls were doing.
Oti: Nope.
Oti: It was not a thing where I was from. Duh. Bloody hell. Didn't even realize Bend and Snap was from Legally Blonde until much later in life. So
KT: We've unlocked that reference for you. Yeah. Yeah.
KT: I think this is also why I don't like Marvel films. I don't like when I hear dialogue and I feel like the writer feels like it's gonna be popular. It's why I don't really like Marvel films. It's why I really don't care for Breaking Bad because it's all full of those,
KT: you know, wank over yourself sort of one liners. And this bend and snap, they may not like, okay, cool. You say bend and snap, my mom taught me it. Okay, cool. But they literally did a whole scene on it. Maybe just didn't register because there was a snap bit. Maybe it was just bend out of it like, oh, yeah. That's a callback to Oti saying he's an ass man. A a fat ass man or just an ass man?
Oti: Just an ass man. Yeah.
KT: I don't know. Like, I I get why people quote and reference bend and snap. But for me, I'm like, I am capable of enjoying things. I wanna make that very clear, friends and lovers. I am capable. I'm fully amenable to the discussion of enjoying light films. It just doesn't happen to be this one. Last thing I wanna talk about before we get to the second film was Vivian's character. So a lot of the time, you know, when we're watching a story,
KT: it really depends on what the point of view is in regards to who's evil or who's the deplorable character. I don't necessarily think Vivian was a problem. And I also think her behavior made sense because she's been with this guy, they're engaged, and the blonde ex just shows up at Harvard.
KT: Anybody would feel a way about that.
Oti: I'm I'm I'm actually right with this because I didn't like Vivian, man. She did not need to come out with a clause up from the
KT: But get how she was written in the story from that point of view. But I'm saying it's understandable
KT: that she was a bit sour about the situation.
Oti: I feel like there's sour and then she it's those what Vivian was. She was beyond sour. She went out of her way to make Elle's life miserable.
KT: But that's just the nature of this film because we weren't going to get any sort of nuance. I get you. I'm I'm not going to fight you on that because there wasn't much more than surface
KT: in regards to layers. But what I didn't care for was her just randomly suddenly being nice for no reason.
Oti: Yeah. The the flip happened quite rapidly and suddenly.
Oti: Yeah. We didn't see why it happened and how it came to be. Maybe she saw that, oh, maybe Elle isn't that bad. Once she started getting she got, you know, appointed into this sort of what was the role? She got appointed as an associate, and she was like, okay. Maybe she's got some chops. Maybe I need to be friendly with her. But that sort of realization, that epiphany,
Oti: we weren't made aware of. So when she finally just became, oh, hey, I'm your buddy. I was like, when did this happen?
KT: Yeah. Well, I thought she was going to get close to her to undermine
KT: her. But I looking back on it now, I think she got close to her just so it could be more shocking when she saw her and Victor Garber. Sorry, we know we love Victor Garber. He has a face that says Victor Garber and his actions in the film obviously don't reflect the face of Victor Garber. We get that. Right? But when she was so pulled off being like, oh, that's how you got your way there. Right? But then in the present, she was like, oh, I've got some apologizing to do. Like whiplash.
KT: Yep. Alright. Let's move on to the second film. I will say I like the way they opened the film. I thought the scrapbook was a very cute way to recap what had happened. Yep. We've kind of made it an event now when a new film, like say John Wick, for example, we watched the films leading up to the new release. But I guess if you didn't watch Legally Blonde and in two years have passed and you're at the sequel, you should probably just go home. Don't don't do not collect $200.
KT: Do not pass go. Just go back home. But if you do make it to the sequel, they do a very nice way of recapping the events of the first film by going through that scrapbook. I thought that was very cute.
Oti: Yeah. That was cute. They also added some more info information in there, telling us about that, you know, they got married and they had what Elle had studied her own she joined a law firm rather. So it was good. I enjoyed that. Yeah.
KT: What I enjoyed even more was seeing Ma at Versace. More succinctly, Octavia Spencer playing a role of the security in the Versace cosmetics building. Just a shout out, we love Octavia Spencer. We do love Octavia Spencer. Not as much as she loved the kids. Oti, I wanna ask you a very important question. When did you realize in this second movie that this was going to drastically deteriorate from what we just watched?
Oti: When she was fired. When she was fired from a job because I expected this to be her career progression into something else. Mhmm. How vying a partnership seat and how battle to get there. I thought that was the next step. But she was fired because she didn't understand that law and the truth or whatever when she thought, well, she had still this naivete even after being a lawyer and mingling with people like that. She thought that, oh, our client does this, is a cosmetic company that tests on animals.
Oti: If we tell them it's not the right thing to do, surely they'll stop. That's your fucking business, mate.
KT: It's not cute. You're too old to be walking around that naive or maybe you're just too rich to be walking around with any sort of reality. Because again, like the soundtrack, there wasn't a care in the world. And I guess in some cases, class and then wealth can insulate you from some real shit. But at that point, it's not cute. How long have you been living in this lawyer world
KT: where you don't realize it? And I think that that comes to the crux of my foundational qualms in regards to the second film because the first film very succinctly had the dynamic of a very beautiful and smart person. Right? It's not fair for us average looking people, but there are those that exist that are ridiculously, irresistibly attractive, but they also have a lot to offer in way of intelligence. Right? So they really played on that dynamic in the first movie, even though there really wasn't much to stretch in regards to that particular
KT: dynamic or bend and snap, if you'll pardon the pun. We got to where we needed to go in the first film. Therefore, there was nothing left for the second film. So everything that that that just barely worked in the first film completely fell to tethers in the second. And that's exactly it. Her naivety
KT: made sense in that moment in the first film, but don't carry that shit over to the second movie because you should know better now. Mhmm. Yeah. Because she's she's meant to be enlightened now. Yeah. She's meant to know how the world works. She's meant she's been doing it. But just fucking grow up. Like, it's unfortunate.
Oti: But why do you think you get paid so much by people that potentially are guilty? It's like Why call a shit? It's like she took five steps back from who she was as a character in the first movie. Yeah. I'm like, where
Oti: did this come from?
KT: It was her Bold and the Beautiful Amnesia season.
Oti: Yeah. Yeah. And they referenced Hope and Stefano.
KT: This is classic Young and the Restless shit. Oh, yeah. We can't even afford Bold and the Beautiful. We're young and the Yeah. Like, there were things that, you know, I just nodded my head or shook my head quietly and continued in the first movie. And they did had the audacity to try and do it again in the second film. It just it wasn't right. Even the whole hair minority group, like the lady with the red hair as a fellow hair minority group member, come on. And actually,
KT: let's talk about it. Because that red headed lady, as soon as Elle found out that they were from the same sorority,
KT: full one eighty.
Oti: And it's weird she didn't notice that they were from the same sorority because Elle had been wearing that ring and that chain throughout. Exactly. It's quite noticeable.
KT: Yeah. And I guess to answer the question I asked you, there were so many moments where I realized that this was a problem. Yeah. I just didn't care for a lot of a lot of the moments in the second movie. And what what film did you say that you appreciated
KT: more while we were watching this?
Oti: I said I appreciated Jesus Rolls more because I thought there was a bottom, but my bottom was not as low as I thought it would be. I guess This he just sank it lower. I guess he hit blonde bottom. Man.
KT: I wow. This, very not good. Just very not good.
Oti: And the last thing is, taking into account though, they've been given 48,000,000 to make this. That's incredibly huge amount of money you put into this, and you think that this is a fucking end product. You're like, come on now. Greater films were made for most
KT: Oh,
KT: absolutely. Do better. Speaking of be better, do better, I spoke about it in the first film. I'm gonna bring it up again. I don't like the way they punched out on the queer community again in regards to the dogs.
Oti: Yeah. That was a thing, wasn't it?
KT: And I think the the the business was called poodles do pilates, but the quote was her shouting your dogs are gay.
Oti: Really?
KT: Maybe I'm old. Maybe I'm bitter, but I'd rather be that than stoop to that sort of humor. It's disgusting.
Oti: Yeah. That was that was shit. Like, by that point, I'd already checked out from the movie, to be honest. Like, a lot of the things that I thought the first movie would fall victim to, it all happened here, like you said. Like, it just was low hanging fruit to another low hanging fruit to another stereotype.
Oti: Like, it was just
KT: It's like we get it. Like, we get that you choose to be ignorant about this shit. We get it. You don't need to keep giving us evidence about that. I think this is my Shrek episode. It is. I think I've hit my Shrek episode. Friends and lovers, deep in Pamela Anderson's Panini's, we did record a Shrek episode and it was supposed to bring levity to the world, but Oti was a fucking ogre in that And he was not a fan of the jovial offerings
KT: that Shrek had. And I think this is my Shrek episode because I I actually, I did enjoy the first movie even though I had problems about them, you know, the the unnecessary dialogue to particular communities. But I did enjoy it. I I enjoyed it for what it was. This second one was absolutely terrible. So just my general overall experience has been soured.
Oti: Yeah. I see that. I see that.
KT: I've exceeded my eye roll quota this year because that cheerleading dance routine was not something that the world ever needs to see.
KT: I think they'll try another bend and snap there. It just didn't work. Right. And that that's actually the whole point. That that that's the whole second movie rolled into that sound bite.
Oti: Yeah. Yeah. True.
KT: Alright, Oti. Let's finish off talking about Regina King because at least we can end it in a good way.
Oti: I love Regina King. Think you get your paycheck girl, but I'll just say that did.
KT: But you know what? Like, I think it's the Bridgerton effect. Because once we saw Regina King, it really contextualized the struggle that others of different races and different classes have to go through. The hoops that weren't in Elle's way was certainly in the way of other people. So it grounded this airy fairy film even more and it worked against it. Because you see Regina King trying as much as she can, and then Elle having this stupid conversation or this stupid sort of coming to herself speech being like, oh, I found my own voice
KT: as if Regina King is the powers that she's fighting against. I didn't care for that. Or she's doing some old archaic methods
KT: and she's not into it.
Oti: Mate, she's into it. She's onto the beat. She's it's taken her two weeks to even get a meeting. It happens. But Regina King, like h h h, knew it was time to play the game.
KT: Yeah. Because you can't and unless you are Elle in this fantasy world, you can't go against the institution. You kind of just have to go where it's going. And that's also another thing that bothered me in the first film. If Elle wasn't Elle of class, and I'll say race, that It doesn't work. Yeah. It doesn't work. Her application to go to Harvard wouldn't have even been entertained because she wasn't even studying law.
Oti: She was studying fabrics or some shit. Yeah. It wouldn't have it it wouldn't have gone through. And I think that's a sort of the thing I knew. I know this is not where they're going with the movie in the second movie, but it just showed exactly
Oti: what the contrast.
KT: It grounds the film. Yeah. And this is a fantasy film, again, where people drink out of public water fountains. It doesn't work when you ground it. And, you know, even when, you know, her character was talking to Elle about the housing policy. She said she was gonna root for it because that's a that's a rich people's thing. Right? She even talks about class there. And her whole character, as much as we love Regina King, but her whole character was undone
KT: in the final act where she was like, you know when I told you about all of those people that thought they could make a change? It was me.
Oti: You know what? Don't apologize. Don't feel hollow. We all thought we can make changes but the world gets in the way. Not for Elle. Yeah. But in trying to follow Riley's advice in getting out of the way, it just doesn't work.
KT: It just redirects in your direction. Yeah.
Oti: The shape bands, it's like It's it's like those bullets in bullets in Wanted, you know?
KT: Oh, nice.
Oti: She follows you. She follows you hard.
KT: Yeah. Exactly.
Oti: You know, after this, I'll forget Regina King was in this movie. Yeah. Me too. I don't need this to appear in our portfolio in my mind. Out of respect. Out of respect. Out of respect. I will get out of the way.
KT: Nice. Thank you, Oti. That's a great way to end this episode. We're gonna finish off in a segment we call For Your Reference,
KT: Oti.
Oti: You know all our reference? Walk the Line. I love some Reese Witherspoon and she's great in that.
KT: Oh, okay.
KT: Apparently she was wearing a wig in the second, which was very obvious and it was because her hair was so short and Sweet Home Alabama. Mhmm. Alright. I'm gonna leave Reese alone at least for a little while. I will reference Shrek Because please don't unsubscribe from the KT fandom. There is podcast evidence that I can enjoy light films with premises that aren't necessarily grounded in reality. And you might reconsider subscribing to Oti's fandom. So make sure you watch Shrek just to feel good and then listen to our pod to hear me feel good. Mhmm.
KT: If you want us to make you feel good on Twitter and Instagram, we're @ForYourRefPod. Write us an email at hello@fyrpodcast.com. We're also on don't punch down on community podcast if you like to leave a rating and review. And we'll see you guys next week.
Oti: See you.
KT: Bend
KT: and fuck off.
Oti: Or just bend.
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