Interview with “One Mind, One Heart” Director, Larissa Behrendt

Full transcript of Interview with “One Mind, One Heart” Director, Larissa Behrendt.

0:04KT: Larissa Behrendt, a Euahleyai/Gamillaroi woman, is also an academic, lawyer, award winning author and award winning filmmaker. One Mind, One Heart follows the historic Yirrkala Bark petition where it's found in Derby, Western Australia, where the community begin the ceremony of guiding its journey back to the Yolngu country. One Mind, One Heart will screen on SBS on the 19th of January. Larissa, thank you so much and welcome to the For Your Reference Podcast.

0:35Larissa: Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you for that lovely introduction.

0:39KT: And Um, and we're going to be covering this in our podcast. How do you know what's coming? Oh, well, it's all your credentials. I'm just here to read it. I feel like we've had a very spiritual journey because we covered You Can Go Now on our podcast. Last year, every Invasion Day, January 26, we try and cover a blackfella story or a TV show, um, or a series. So first off. Of all of the things that I want to talk about today, I just want to first off say congratulations to such a poignant documentary film in One Mind, One Heart and also the premiere at the Adelaide Film Festival. How was all of that?

1:14Larissa: Uh, thank you. Uh, it was wonderful. I mean, the most exciting thing was to have, um, Yananymul Mununggurr there, who was, is our kind of lead character and, uh, to see her. Celebrated for her strength and, um, that she liked the film, which is always reassuring. Um, it was wonderful, lovely community turnout and it was great to, um, you know, have the film be released to the world.

1:41KT: Yeah. And, and speaking of, you know, being for the people and pulling up for, you know, um, black stories, shout outs to your Speaking Out on ABC Radio. If I can plug your podcast, um, the radio

1:52Larissa: Please, please

1:53KT: it was a September episode where, um, you and, uh, Clare. Had the bark petition, um, as well. So there's definitely a lot of information out there if friends and lovers want to go out and get that information. Um, but I guess starting off with, you know, the portfolio across all industries that you have. I would love to hear. If there is a difference or if you feel there's a sameness or if there's any sort of elasticity the media or the filmmaking aspect might give you as opposed to academia or are they both the same you know one hand of the other.

2:28Larissa: Yeah, actually, and probably the journey into filmmaking and storytelling broadcasting is probably part of my growth as an advocate and starting to more deeply understand that. Sometimes you need to be able to translate for your clients and put their story forward. But there is great transformative power in being able to create space for the people that you're wanting to support, whose stories you want to tell, to tell their stories themselves, that actually that is the most powerful way to get. Um, across to a broader audience. So, I mean, I feel like everything I'm drawn to has similar threads in it. It's about the assertion of sovereignty and the principle of self determination. It's about social justice. It's about, um, law reform. It's about challenging the colonial structures that continue to infringe on the lives of Indigenous people.

3:40Larissa: It's about celebration of culture and resilience. And I do find I'm drawn to a story with strong Aboriginal women in it.

3:48KT: we need to support our staunch black women. Absolutely. Um, and I, I guess I wanted to open with that because, you know, there's so much in regards to reports in, in regards to Indigenous people and these documentary films are a way to contextualize and really bring to the heart these very stories and experiences that we're talking about.

4:13Larissa: Yeah, I feel like documentary is a, is a great, um, mechanism for being able to provide space for people to share their experiences, especially people who've been somewhat marginalized or silenced by their experiences within colonial structures. Um, it's a great way to show the compelling impact of policies and laws that are wrong. But it's also such a great way to show the strength and resilience of the community. And in that way, really, um, address or confront issues. Stereo, negative stereotypes. I always hope that when people see the strength and wisdom of the people in, um, some of the stories I tell, that they, um, can really see why we advocate for self determination and can really see why We have the answers to our problems in our own community, if that agency is respected and fostered.

5:24Larissa: Um, so I do feel like storytelling does a lot of, a lot of heavy lifting, but I also think it's important as a way to chronicle and capture, um, our experiences for ourselves as First Nations people. It's a part of our ongoing legacy of handing down stories. Thank you.

5:44KT: Yeah, and I think it's very much, we've been here, where have you guys been? Like, everyone else, like, needs to catch up. And what I really loved about, you know, we can talk about the chronicling, um, in the film, but what I also really loved about, you know, the, the selection of, I guess, I don't even know if you would call them subjects, but like, we have different voices that are in One Mind, One Heart. We talked about Professor Clare, um, for example. There's also Professor Peter Yu. Like, there's so many great voices and I also feel like it's like, It's hard enough to have that conversation if we can be very real in so called Australia. But also understanding that, you know, Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people aren't a monolith as well.

6:25KT: So it was really great to hear different voices, um, with different passions and different interests and different focus, um, in One Mind, One Heart. Did you find, uh, was it much of a balance to try and figure out how to weave that into One Mind, One Heart?

6:43Larissa: I think my practice as a filmmaker is always fairly eclectic. I'm always bringing different elements into the film. And when I originally think of the strands I want, and I talk to my producer and say, you know, I want to have some animation and I want to have this and I want to have that. They're like, no, it's never going to work. But I kind of feel like the process of bringing those threads together is almost like a process of weaving. And it's And you have to go with your instinct. Let's say this to any storyteller or, you know, creative practitioner, those honing those instincts when you think actually, I'm not quite sure why I think it's these elements, but this is where my instincts are.

7:23Larissa: Um, but I, I tend to with my storytelling as well, where I will bring in. People like Clare Wright, and in this case, Professor John Carty, who was involved with, Clare Wright was writing the book about the Yirrkala barks when she suggested the repatriation and facilitated that. Professor John Carty was involved with the, um, the processes of, uh, restoring the bark petition because it had been in a place where it had been affected by humidity. So just restoring it. Um, there, the two non Indigenous experts in a way, and they earn their place in the film because they are actually a part of that story. But I'm always really mindful of, in terms of giving the colour and the expertise around the story, to use our First Nations experts. So to lean on people like, um, Nicole Watson, who I think is an amazing scholar, Jacqui Katona, who's herself been a formidable land rights campaigner and is also a huge intellect.

8:34Larissa: And as you

8:35KT: Jacqui said. I was like, tick,

8:36Larissa: Oh, my God. And, and, and honestly, I could have just had her just her interviews alone. She's extraordinary. Um,

8:45KT: you don't mind, there was a, um, there was a particular moment where, uh, it was focusing on mining and Jacqui said, research will show often communities are substantially disadvantaged throughout the process and beyond the mining project, which is one of those things that, you know, is true, but it's important to have the research there, but it's just, you just want to shake people up, Larissa. Mm hmm.

9:07Larissa: that's right. It's true, because we often get told, you know, it gives us jobs and well, um, she and she is really, um, a force of nature. Peter Yu, who actually knew Stan Davey, who's. who was gifted the, uh, bark painting that was repatriated. He, he's an enormous intellect. He's an enormous amount as well. So, um, and I, I have to say John Maynard, our, um, First Nations historian is, is kind of one of my go to people for all my films. Um, but just to sort of say that there is this huge pool of talent that we have that sits in our community and we know it. These are the people we go to for advice, or we know their insights, but other people don't see that they're obviously good, good First Nations people with high profiles who get asked over and over again, but to dig into that, that deeper pool and, and showcase that, um, Pat Turner, also, who's, who You know, force of nature was really at the coalface of a lot of the issues that we were talking about.

10:16Larissa: Another extraordinary voice. So one of the things I love about the process of bringing the story to a story together is you always have your spine. And in this case, it's that. Lovely repatriation story, which to me was, was of course about the bark, but it was about Yananymul's wish, her passion to have that returned for her father, the last surviving signatory. That father daughter story for me was the heart of the film. So it's the thread through, but it allows us to open a door and Take people through to history, experience, perspective and expertise. And I, I love that, that, um, that creative process of bringing those stories together. And especially when I can weave into it, people who I just love and admire for their own body of work and their own wisdom.

11:13KT: guess we can see how we feel about this question. You're more than welcome to, we can move, you know, somewhere else, but I, it's, it's hard not to acknowledge a post Indigenous Voice to Parliament. Um, and it was also in the documentary as well. Is it, is that, I guess that uncomfortability that non Indigenous people have in so called Australia, is that something that you're conscious of when you're making this? Or is it like a Richard Bell, You Can Go Now, like, this is what it is, you can take it or leave

11:48Larissa: Um, well, Richard's his own sort of awesome nature. Look, um, I, I think when, when you're doing a film of somebody else's story, I think it's really important that you try and find their voice and their tone in it. And I think a lot about what I learned from making the film Maralinga Tjarutja with the Maralinga Tjarutja people about the impact of nuclear testing on their country. If that was my country. I would be the angriest of blacks. I really am an angry black woman.

12:26KT: There's another level you

12:27Larissa: of posed myself. But it was not right to tell their story in the tone that I would have, because they are a very wise and gentle, um, they have a very wise and gentle way of communicating, and I wanted to capture that. And I, I feel like one of the things that the Yolngu have continued to do is to act with generosity and they act with openness and with real dignity and grace. They're very strong about who they are and they're uncompromising with that, which I hugely admire. But with, with maintaining that integrity, they are very generous.

13:05Larissa: in their continual offer. And the, the, the bark petition reflects that. So it felt like that needed to be a part of how we would approach a conversation post the referendum. And I, I think it is, as you say, it's important to acknowledge that we have a landscape now for Indigenous affairs that has been defined by that referendum and that. First Nations people across Australia and, and some of our allies have felt. The, the trauma and strain of that experience of both the process of the referendum and the discussions around it and then the feeling of rejection when the ref, the referendum, um, secured a no vote. Um, and so I, I don't think you can ignore that.

13:59Larissa: And I also think stories have their own way of telling you it's time for them to be told.

14:07KT: Mm

14:09Larissa: As Clare says in the film, her decision to even investigate the, or research the bark petitions came to her from Galarrwuy Yunupingu, who clearly as an elder understood, believed the time was right for that story to be told. And then the chain of events happens. I never think there's a coincidence when something is significant. As a bark petition, which was gifted out. It wasn't a stolen artifact. This was a gift. It was then on a path to come back home that there was any, I don't believe that was a coincidence. Um, I might not understand what the significance is, but there would be a reason why that is what's happening.

14:56Larissa: But, but fundamentally what I did understand was one of the key. elements of that bark petition was the, the request, the dignified request that there be consultation about what happens on Yolngu land with the Yolngu.

15:15KT: hmm. Mm hmm. Mm

15:16Larissa: And it feels that, that request for the respect of sitting down at a table as equals is as relevant today as it was in 1963. And I think we can reflect on the fact that there has been a rejection, whatever our positions were, whatever one's position was. There was a rejection of the concept that Aboriginal people should have a seat at the table. And that does tell us that that petition continues to be a reminder that Aboriginal people have extended that hand with friendship.

15:53KT: Or even the way that uh, the signatories would happen and what would get acknowledged and, you know. And I think that just speaks to the resilience and the resistance of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people. We're seeing, you know, a global uprooting and collective liberation of all Indigenous people, even in Aotearoa, for example, as well. And, you know, I think it's, it's, it's well meaning allies like myself that need to continue to show up and to pull up. Um, and I really love that you bring it to the center because obviously there are panel topics that we can talk about, but it really is about the Yolngu people and the Yirrkala, um, bark petition and I guess just noting that there were different versions of it and there were also different, uh, different languages, um, as well.

16:44Larissa: So the petitions themselves were, you know, a beautiful coming together of, of the many clans of the Yolngu, um, it's where the title One Mind, One Heart comes from, because repeatedly when people were describing the process, Yolngu people, or describing other ways the community comes together, they will say we came together with one mind, one heart, one voice, or one mind, one heart, you know, one question or something like that, and it was like a And a continual refrain that I heard and that ability to bring together their, their diverse clans with a single voice, um, is really a testament to their power and also their political savviness.

17:29Larissa: I think one thing that the Yirrkala barks reflect is the political sophistication of the Yolngu and their, their legal sophistication as well. And for a group that Maybe most people might know through Yothu Yindi, um, and Treaty or through their music and their, you know, they've got wonderful artists, they've got wonderful performers, their, their creative practice, you know, has, has really been, you know, internationally recognized, but actually underneath that and perhaps intertwined with that is a extraordinary political savviness. And that comes from their ability to come together with their diverse clans, um, and their diverse leadership with a, with a single voice. And it is, you know, I think that is a lesson to all of us about the importance of, um, thinking about what it means. Um, to be strong as First Nations people by finding that way internally to build our alliances and our, and our, um, our voice and our perspective, rather than have outsiders.

18:41Larissa: split us off and, and to be caught up in politics in a way that we're not in control of. There's so much dignity in how they behave as a community. There's really so much that we can all learn from them.

18:57KT: Absolutely. And I guess for our friends and lovers that maybe haven't watched One Mind, One Heart or they have just watched it and now they're listening to the interview, is there a goal or a hope that you have for people that are watching the film?

19:11Larissa: Um, well, I guess the, the hope for First Nations people is to remember that. resilience. There's even just in the film, you know, we covered the, the, um, the referendum, but, you know, this is a community that was hugely impacted by the abolition of ATSIC and was hugely impacted by the intervention. And they have been continuous about their support for their rights and their culture in that environment, they have just remained steadfast. And I think that's a real testament from looking at just how the Yolngu have been from the 1960s through to today, that they've never wavered from who they are or what their political ambitions are. And I think that's inspiring for, for all of us as First Nations people. I think for me, it's It's a celebration of resilience and strength, and for non Indigenous people, I hope it is an insight into a history that they probably don't know, a deeper understanding of not just the political history, that important political history, um, and legal history that the barks represent, but that long cultural connection to country that won't be broken, no matter what happens, and perhaps a moment to reflect on the fact that that political agenda is going to continue.

20:37Larissa: It's going to continue to be our goal and our ambition for the Yolngu. They represent, in many ways, the hopes and dreams of First Nations people around the country. Their politics is our politics. Their ambitions are our ambitions. And to perhaps more deeply understand that and You know, I think part of the importance of telling these stories to non Indigenous people is for them to find ways into understanding our culture and our history and our lived experience to better find their place within this country, whose history they now share, whose storytelling they now share. And not just to acknowledge that this is You know, the First Nations history of this country, but to ask themselves, what is their role in the next iteration of these stories?

21:30KT: hmm. I love that. Uh, I just need to sit in that for a second. Um, but I, I absolutely love that. And even being able to, uh, Talanoa like talk to you today, I got a lot more insight after watching the documentary, which I really appreciated. So I thank you for the film as well as for your time today. I'm going to wrap up with our final question. Uh, we finish off our reviews with a recommendation. So what would you pair with? One Mind, One Heart as a double feature. It can be a television series as well as a film as

22:10Larissa: Well, it's an upcoming one.

22:12KT: Oh, exclusive scoop.

22:14Larissa: I'm going to, I'm going to suggest, um, well, if people haven't seen the First Inventors, they should have a look at that, um, to get a deeper understanding of Aboriginal history, culture and knowledges. That's on SBS, but, um, Top End Bub is coming up, Miranda Tapsell's follow up to her film Top End Wedding, um, and it is filled with her sense of humor. It's filled with that Darwin sense of fun. It's, um, all about blackfella love. Um, it's got, it's got, it's joyous, but it also hits some hard issues. So if you want something, um, that's entertaining, but also will give you a real insight into the warmth within First Nations families, watch out for Top End Bub.

23:07KT: I love that. And the way that you just lit up because there is so much joy as well.

23:13Larissa: There is. Yep.

23:14KT: Larissa, thank you so much for your time.

23:16Larissa: Oh, thank you so much. It's been a privilege to have a chat with you.

23:19KT: Thank you.